[OSM-legal-talk] ODbL: Produced Works other than maps
frederik at remote.org
Mon Mar 29 18:57:50 BST 2010
Arne Johannessen wrote:
> I assumed the bakeries were already present in OSM as shop=bakery
> nodes, but understand now you meant for them to be added from another
No, I was thinking of bakeries that were added to OSM in the course of
normal mapping, by lots of people.
> But the point is that even though the image itself isn't covered by
> sui generis database rights, the actual content *displayed* in the
> image still is. That's what I think the ODBL means with section 4.4 (c):
> # A Derivative Database is Publicly Used and so must comply with
> # Section 4.4. if a Produced Work created from the Derivative Database
> # is Publicly Used.
Well you seem to have a little bit of legal background so I hesitate to
simply say "no" - any view onto ODbL by someone not "tainted" by the OSM
view is most welcome.
The main idea behind the paragraph you quoted is that we want the
If someone improves OSM data and makes a Produced Work from it, we want
him to share the improved data.
For the bakery scenario, since the database behind the map tile (as well
as the database behind the published list) is pure OSM, just filtered by
region and theme, I think that in lieu of actually publishing the
derived database it would be sufficient to say that you've been using
OSM and whoever wants to reproduce your image or list is welcome to use
> Since your map or list of bakeries was to be made public on the web,
> any OSM data you included may be reused directly from your map or
> list, hence attribution as per section 4.2 ODBL is required (for the
> OSM database or significant extract the map or list is based upon).
But since the list of bakeries or the map tile are Produced Works, I
can, while complying with attribution requirements, publish the list
under a PD license, thus waiving downstream attribution requirements.
> In other words, while the map image may not strictly speaking fall
> under the ODBL, the map data still does.
I'm only concerned with the image and its uses right now.
> In plain English, the ODBL continues to apply to those map contents
> that ware taken from an ODBL source without virally 'infecting' the
> other map contents. The final map image is, however, covered by CC-BY-
> SA in its completeness.
That would be my reading as well. I also think that CC-BY-SA has no
built-in requirement to transport the message "parts of the data from
which this work was created are ODbL licensed" further downstream, and
expressly prohibits anyone to interfere with the downstream chain, which
means that, in order to make this derived image possible, ODbL must not
require this notice. (Attribution is fine - CC-BY-SA supports that idea.)
> A single map tile is unlikely to even qualify as a database under
> either the ODBL or the EU database directive.
> However, if one plans to combine ODBL data with a database not covered
> by ODBL (as in your CC-BY-SA example above), I believe ODBL's
> Collective Database concept is the only possible way this can work if
> you want to avoid the viral aspect of ODBL.
I don't have a problem with the viral aspect of the database, I just
want to be able to publish a paper map (or something) without any
virality - *especially* no competing virality between ODbL and something
Frederik Ramm ## eMail frederik at remote.org ## N49°00'09" E008°23'33"
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