[Osmf-talk] Proposal - OSMF Should **NOT** Adopt a Code of Conduct

Rafael Avila Coya ravilacoya at gmail.com
Sun Dec 3 22:47:51 UTC 2017


Hi, Emily:

On 03/12/17 23:06, Emily Eros wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> As someone who generally doesn't participate in these mailing lists, I 
> very much disagree with this statement:
> "Some people feel frightened to participate in mailing lists? Well, I 
> think it's very exaggerated and makes me smile in general."
> 
> I can wholeheartedly say that YES, this is a space that I don't feel 
> comfortable participating in. It's great to see people passionate about 
> OSM, but this space feels fraught with hostility and personal tensions - 
> some of which goes years back. It's easy to feel like saying something 
> is going to leave me feeling attacked. For me, I don't see an obvious 
> way to contribute and try to make this better, so YES, it is very 
> tempting to just disengage. I know I'm not alone in that, so I'd really 
> encourage you to take it seriously when people say that they don't feel 
> comfortable contributing to the mailing lists.

I take it very seriously: the sole idea of a CoC makes me frightened and 
feel unconfortable.

I follow and participate in many mailing lists (Spanish, French and 
English). Tell the talk-es about a CoC and then come here to tell me 
what they think... And some of the people in favor of a CoC are talking 
about a CoC for the overall OSM community, no less.

> 
> To me, it seems like all the loudest voices are the ones having this 
> conversation. As someone who participates less, I can say that the 
> existence of a CoC (carefully drafted, with community input and caution 
> about how to design this well) is something that would make me feel more 
> comfortable here.

Loud? We are writing, not talking here.

> 
> "In that context, and without any intention to offend anyone, I'd give 
> more value in this matter to the opinion of people who are more likely 
> to be the victims of harassment and abusive behavior, compared to the 
> opinion of white males who argue out of the safety of their privileged 
> status."

White males... privileged status... yes, that's true. But we don't need 
a CoC for that, we need just common sense and be aware of the little 
details that lead to genre inequality. We can handle that, maybe with 
difficulties, but we can, because we are a civilized and healthy 
community. It's a question of listening to each other, but talking 
freely, not under presure or autocensorship.

Cheers,

Rafael.

> 
> +1 to that, and thanks to Nikos for pointing it out.
> 
> My two cents.
> Emily
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sun, Dec 3, 2017 at 11:12 AM, Nikos Roussos <comzeradd at fsfe.org 
> <mailto:comzeradd at fsfe.org>> wrote:
> 
>     > I have more interesting things to do in life,
>     > like mapping for example.
> 
>     So you only do one interesting thing at a time? Please let's avoid
>     undervaluing what other people may find interesting.
> 
>     > Any code of conduct will make people more or less autocensure. I can't
>     > see any interest of having that thing, unless for control.
> 
>     If a CoC make people to auto-censor from abusive behavior I'd say
>     it's worth it.
> 
> 
>     This is a nice read on the value of a CoC in a community:
>     http://incisive.nu/2014/codes-of-conduct/
>     <http://incisive.nu/2014/codes-of-conduct/>
> 
>     For those who don't have the time to read it all a very good
>     argument is that "you aren’t creating a code of conduct only - or
>     even primarily - for the people who are likely to break it. You’re
>     creating it to make it clear to anyone who has been harmed or
>     harassed, online or off, that your space is safe for them."
> 
>     In that context, and without any intention to offend anyone, I'd
>     give more value in this matter to the opinion of people who are more
>     likely to be the victims of harassment and abusive behavior,
>     compared to the opinion of white males who argue out of the safety
>     of their privileged status.
> 
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> 
> 
> 
> 
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