[Tagging] Signal-controlled roundabouts

Wed Jun 18 06:38:29 UTC 2014

If I am not mistaken, the French were the first to have roaundabouts in
quantities, but they all had the priority-to-the-right rule at the time,
i.e. the priority was to the traffic entering the circle. See
http://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrefour_giratoire
This was one of the particularities you needed to be aware of living in
Germany near the border and crossing over into France frequently.
Only relatively recently (1984) the French introduced the roundabout with
priority in the ring.
As the Wikipedia article shows, the original French sign for roundabout
implied the priorité a droite and is identical to the one shown in the
Croatian example (
https://maps.google.hr/?ll=45.492397,15.549753&spn=0.004543,0.00883&t=h&z=17&layer=c&cbll=45.492457,15.549814&panoid=606WGc-Rt8U3f-UU0k0WLQ&cbp=12,196.42,,0,11.92
)?
Janko may be able to confirm that the Croatian Highway Code gives the
priority to the right in roundabouts.

On 18 June 2014 02:37, Fernando Trebien <fernando.trebien at gmail.com> wrote:

> IMHO I think that the main idea in the concept of "roundabout" is that
> the center of the cycle (which may not be a perfect circle, sometimes
> not even an ellipse) has right of way over entering traffic. That's
> why I find it weird when:
> - Croatian (and perhaps some other) authorities apply the roundabout
> sign to a circle where entering traffic has right of way (that's the
> exact opposite of the original idea)
> - US authorities won't consider a roundabout a circle when all
> entrances have "stop" signs
> - Brazilians (but not the authorities) call pretty much any circular
> structure a "roundabout" (I'm Brazilian btw)
>
> However, these could probably be considered local adaptations of the
> original concept - which kind of defeat its original purpose.
>
> When using navigation apps, it makes sense to get special instructions
> only (and always) when you have right of way because of the many
> factors the driver needs to pay attention to while in the circle. In
> other non-roundabout circles, the driver has to stop within the
> circle, so he/she may receive additional voice instructions at each
> stop.
>
> Other than navigation, I don't see a good reason to tag roundabouts.
>
> On Tue, Jun 17, 2014 at 6:42 PM, Paul Johnson <baloo at ursamundi.org> wrote:
> > Wonder if we're talking regional differences.  The south of France is
> known
> > to follow the Vienna Convention on Traffic (traffic in the circle yields
> to
> > traffic entering from the right), and the US and Canada make no signage
> > differences between a roundabout and a traffic circle.  For navigation
> > purposes, they're functionally identical contexts, as to who has the
> right
> > of way, I believe that should be best clarified by strategically placed
> > nodes or relations for traffic signals, stop or give way.
> >
> > On Jun 17, 2014 4:27 PM, "Volker Schmidt" <voschix at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> No. One of the characteristics of a roundabout is that you have
> precedence
> >> when you are in it. In this case there is a main road that has
> precedence
> >> over the two minor roads.
> >> If you want to turn left (looking in the direction of the photo) you
> have
> >> to yield to oncoming traffic coming from the opposite direction.
> >> This is a main road crossing a minor road with an island (or short piece
> >> of dual carriageway) in the middle of the junction
> >>
> >>
> >> On 17 June 2014 22:47, Paul Johnson <baloo at ursamundi.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> I'd call it a full blown roundabout, since you're still expected to go
> >>> around it to the right in order to go left.
> >>>
> >>> On Jun 17, 2014 3:43 PM, "Tod Fitch" <tod at fitchdesign.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> How would you tag this intersection in Mountain View, California?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> https://www.google.com/maps/place/Mountain+View,+CA/@37.387343,-122.080352,3a,89.9y,118.3h,70.82t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sHblffm0KZ7pzUXLakrlBQw!2e0!4m2!3m1!1s0x808fb7495bec0189:0x7c17d44a466baf9b
> >>>>
> >>>> Should it be tagged as traffic_calming=island instead of
> >>>> highway=mini_roundabout?
> >>>>
> >>>> On Jun 17, 2014, at 1:10 PM, Paul Johnson wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> > Not as rare as you think, and growing more common.  I go through 2
> or
> >>>> > 3 roundabouts regularly.  The US official definitions defined in
> the MUTCD
> >>>> > are that roundabouts are uncontrolled or have yield signs entering,
> traffic
> >>>> > circles have stop signs.  Neither are signal controlled in the
> MUTCD.  We do
> >>>> > not have anything equivalent to the mini roundabout in the US (and
> likely
> >>>> > Canada, Puerto Rico, Guam, and the US Virgin Islands) at all, so
> >>>> > intersections tagged as such are probably wrong.
> >>>> >
> >>>>
> >>>>
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>
> --
> Fernando Trebien
> +55 (51) 9962-5409
>
> "Nullius in verba."
>
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