[Tagging] Tagging detail on Rest Areas

Warin 61sundowner at gmail.com
Thu Apr 27 23:46:52 UTC 2017


On 27-Apr-17 01:43 PM, Marc Gemis wrote:
> do we need the same tags for motorhomes ?

Off topic. They get a mention on the  caravan_site wiki page. I think they are represented by caravan at this time.

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:tourism%3Dcaravan_site


> I recently start seeing rest areas where you have to pay to stay
> overnight, so should we add "fee" to your yes/no choices ?

Off topic. Something like fee:conditional=yes @(sunset-sunrise); no @(sunrise-sunset) ?

>
> m.
>
> On Thu, Apr 27, 2017 at 12:48 AM, Warin <61sundowner at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I have come up with some detail tagging for rest areas but want to get some
>> oversight on it and help with one aspect.
>>
>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Drest_area
>>
>> Easy(?) Details
>>
>> Some of these have time limits - easy enough to use a conditional max stay
>> tag
>>
>>   rest_area:condition:maxstay=20
>>
>> Stops people 'camping' over a long period.
>>
>> Restricted to HGV use only, use access tags
>>
>>   access=no with hgv=yes
>>
>> More difficult detail
>>
>> One I am having problems with, where they can be used for 'camping' with a
>> caravan/camper-van (but probably not a tent).
>>
>> rest_area:camping=caravan
>>
>> or
>>
>> rest_area:camping:caravan=yes
>>
>> would convey the meaning .. but is it a 'good' tag that would allow for
>> other things and follow other tagging methods?
>>
>> caravan=yes could simply mean access and not convey the camping aspect? Note
>> the max stay would still apply (if there).
>>
>>
>> Any thoughts on tagging these features for rest areas?

On 27-Apr-17 11:18 AM, André Pirard wrote:

> Hi,
>
>      
>
>      Your questions show that there is no OSM formal definition of the
>      usage of name space.
>
>      I once sketched one, a key of which is rules to make a canonical
>      representation of the tags.
>
>      It says that for the main tag (the one representing the object (vs
>      attributes))
>
>      highway=rest_area canonically means highway:rest_area=yes
>
>      and that attribute tags append to that.
>
>      So, your examples become
>
>      highway:rest_area:rest_area:camping=caravan
>      
>
>      which in its canonical form is
>      highway:rest_area:rest_area:camping:caravan=yes
>
>      obviously, one rest_area is too much and it must be:
>
>      camping=caravan ==> highway:rest_area:camping:caravan=yes
>
>      camping:caravan=yes ==> highway:rest_area:camping:caravan=yes
>
>      same canonical representation but allowing other attributes of
>      camping than caravan.
>
>      camping=yes (attribute of rest_area) would mean that camping is
>      allowed
>
>      caravan=yes (attribute of rest_area) would mean that the area can be
>      used by caravans
>
>      (but an access=* would be the normal way to do it)
>
>      camping=caravan=yes would mean that the caravans can be used for
>      camping
>
>      
>
>      I hope I made no mistake.

Ok .. so

camping:caravan=yes would be ok.

A wrinkle is the caravan_site key/value

I think this could be used in place of the camping:caravan=yes

http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:tourism%3Dcaravan_site

However it is a key/value itself and that could confuse renders as to what is the primary key/value.

so

highway=rest_area

caravan_site=yes

could be a better way to go?

>
>      
>
>      Well, it's risky writing this.
>
>      Someone may come down on me again to scold me and say : "we" do not
>      do that.
>
>      Very logically not saying who is "we".
>
>      That's apparently not you.

I try to say things about things rather than people. People have all sorts of ideas .. which is what I'm after.

But if 'we' start talking about people they can get upset with 'us' .. and that is not what anyone is after here.

>
>      
>
>      BTW, a rest_area can be just some space beside a road.
>
>      It is not a parking but it can be used to momentarily stop out of
>      the traffic.
>
>      Right?

Correct .. but I would put it this way, in a very simplistic way;

Parking is when you stop (park) to leave your vehicle and do something else - shopping, work, play.

A 'rest area' is where you stop (park) to do nothing (rest).




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