[Tagging] When was the deprecation of location=kiosk for power=substation discussed?

Warin 61sundowner at gmail.com
Thu Apr 26 22:23:45 UTC 2018


The use of the word 'kiosk' may be a jargon use within the power industry?
Or it could be that the size is similar to a normal 'kiosk'?
Maybe the original user could provide some information as to the true 
source?

On 26/04/18 20:33, nwastra wrote:
> Australians also know a kiosk as a small selling booth for small 
> articles e.g. newspapers, sweets, drinks often found on central city 
> railway stations.
>
> N
>
> On 26 Apr 2018, at 8:22 pm, James <james2432 at gmail.com 
> <mailto:james2432 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>> @Peter, Same here in Canada. No one calls a substation a kiosk here
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 26, 2018, 6:16 AM Peter Elderson, <pelderson at gmail.com 
>> <mailto:pelderson at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>     Looks like it's australian, to call a power substation a power
>>     kiosk. It converts the high voltage to low voltage and
>>     distributes power to households. Just 'kiosk' is confusing to me.
>>     Dutch: kiosk=small selling booth for small articles e.g.
>>     newspapers, sweets, drinks. Mainly found on railway stations.
>>
>>     2018-04-26 11:56 GMT+02:00 John Sturdy <jcg.sturdy at gmail.com
>>     <mailto:jcg.sturdy at gmail.com>>:
>>
>>         To me, as a native British-English speaker, "kiosk" doesn't
>>         seem to be the right word for these.  A kiosk is normally
>>         something that *is* large enough for a person to enter
>>         (typically, someone selling something through a hatch).
>>
>>         __John
>>
>>
>>         On Wed, Apr 25, 2018 at 8:53 PM, José G Moya Y.
>>         <josemoya at gmail.com <mailto:josemoya at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>             It was François Lacombe on this list 9n Jan 2, 2018.
>>             El mié., 3 de enero de 2018 0:14, François Lacombe
>>             <fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com
>>             <mailto:fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com>> escribió:
>>
>>                 Hi,
>>
>>                 Regarding this location=kiosk topic, a discussion was
>>                 opened on talk page of power=substation key.
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Kiosk_substations_in_street_cabinets
>>
>>                 Since no big issue has been raised, I've updated
>>                 mentionned wiki pages (with French version when
>>                 available) with man_made=street_cabinet.
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dtransformer#Location_values
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:location
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:substation%3Dminor_distribution
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Location
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dstreet_cabinet
>>
>>                 location=kiosk is not a recommended value anymore and
>>                 it's encouraged to replace it manually and carefully
>>                 with man_made=street_cabinet + street_cabinet=power
>>
>>                 location key can now be used everytime to give the
>>                 right substation/transformer's location, in cabinet
>>                 or not.
>>                 We can have underground or indoor cabinets like this :
>>                 man_made=street_cabinet
>>                 street_cabinet=power
>>                 power=substation
>>                 substation=minor_distribution
>>                 location=underground or indoor or ...
>>
>>                 All the best
>>
>>                 François
>>
>>                 2017-11-04 11:45 GMT+01:00 François Lacombe
>>                 <fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com
>>                 <mailto:fl.infosreseaux at gmail.com>>:
>>
>>                     Hi
>>
>>                     The man_made=street_cabinet key sounds suitable
>>                     to map items described with power=substation +
>>                     location=kiosk.
>>                     They are actual small cabinets like those where
>>                     no technician can enter to work (opposite of
>>                     building) :
>>                     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:10kV_trafo_kiosk.jpg
>>
>>                     Street cabinet is the container while substation
>>                     is the function.
>>
>>                     Wiki example on this page gives follwing tags:
>>                     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Examples
>>                     power=substation
>>                     substation=minor_distribution
>>                     location=kiosk
>>
>>                     I propose to update it as such :
>>                     man_made=street_cabinet
>>                     street_cabinet=power
>>                     power=substation
>>                     substation=minor_distribution
>>                     location=pavement (or wherever the cabinet is
>>                     located)
>>
>>                     It works both for nodes or areas.
>>                     Additionnal advantage is to get location=* back
>>                     to give cabinet position instead of substation
>>                     design (there was issues to tag underground
>>                     kiosks for instance)
>>                     There are 7k objects in db:
>>                     https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/location=kiosk
>>
>>                     Pages to update are :
>>                     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dtransformer#Location_values
>>                     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:location
>>                     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:substation%3Dminor_distribution
>>                     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:power%3Dsubstation#Location
>>                     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dstreet_cabinet
>>
>>                     How do you feel about it ?
>>
>>                     There are no need of a time consuming formal
>>                     proposal to deal with this question.
>>                     Without further coments, i will update wiki pages
>>                     in 15 days.
>>                     No automated edits.
>>
>>                     Thanks for your time
>>
>>                     François
>>
>>
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>>
>>
>>             El mié., 25 de abril de 2018 21:32, Michael Reichert
>>             <osm-ml at michreichert.de <mailto:osm-ml at michreichert.de>>
>>             escribió:
>>
>>                 Hi,
>>
>>                 while adding a substation to OSM yesterday I looked
>>                 up the possible
>>                 values of location=* and missed kiosk. A short glance
>>                 in the history
>>                 showes that it removed location=kiosk from the page
>>                 on 2018-01-02. The
>>                 edit description mentions
>>                 man_made=street_cabinet+street_cabinet=power
>>                 as a replacement.
>>
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:power%3Dsubstation&oldid=1542685
>>
>>                 location=kiosk was introduced by the approved
>>                 Substation Refinement
>>                 Proposal in 2013.
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Substation_refinement#Substation
>>
>>                 man_made=street_cabinet was introduced by the Street
>>                 Cabinet Proposal in
>>                 2014.
>>                 https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Street_cabinet
>>                 This proposal does not mention substations or
>>                 transformers at all.
>>
>>                 I think that small substations are not street
>>                 cabinets because they are
>>                 much larger than street cabinets and are usually not
>>                 located on the
>>                 sidewalk but next to it on a separate area.
>>
>>                 I don't remember a discussion of this change, do you?
>>                 If no, I propose
>>                 to revert this change on the wiki.
>>
>>                 Best regards
>>
>>                 Michael
>>
>>
>>                 -- 
>>                 Per E-Mail kommuniziere ich bevorzugt
>>                 GPG-verschlüsselt. (Mailinglisten
>>                 ausgenommen)
>>                 I prefer GPG encryption of emails. (does not apply on
>>                 mailing lists)
>>
>>

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