[Tagging] Ahkwesáhsne, a territory of the Kanien'kehá:ka Nation of the Haudenosaunee Confederacy Was:Should admin_level=1 tag be applied to EU?

Clifford Snow clifford at snowandsnow.us
Sat Aug 1 20:07:13 UTC 2020

On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 12:27 PM Kevin Kenny <kevin.b.kenny at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Sat, Aug 1, 2020 at 2:25 PM Clifford Snow <clifford at snowandsnow.us>
> wrote:
>> After some digging, it appears that Saint Regis Mohawk Indian Territory
>> is in OSM. Just across the border, on a Saint Lawrence River island, is the
>> Akwesasne 59 First Nations tribe is also in OSM. According to Wikipedia [1]
>> the Mohawk consider their territory to be a single nation, with no border
>> separating its parts.
>> It seems to me that we should map the tribal areas as one. Possibly as a
>> super relation, though I'm not sure if super relations are used for
>> boundaries. What I find interesting is that the Canadian Border Crossing is
>> located on the North side of the Saint Lawrence River while the US crossing
>> station is located on the South side of the river. It seems to imply that
>> the Akwesasne Nation is not in either country.
>> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Regis_Mohawk_Reservation
> It's complicated. (When are sovereignty disputes _not_ complicated?)
> Both the US and Canada consider the river to be the US-Canada boundary,
> and that the reservations are their separate dependencies. The Canadians
> recognize the Six Nations as domestic dependent nations, and they enjoy
> limited sovereignty on their own lands. The US recognizes certain
> Haudenosaunee lands as dependent nations, but Akwesáhsne is not one of
> them, owing to the fact that they have not adopted a written constitution
> and a representative democracy. (In completely open elections, they
> consistently prefer their semi-hereditary chiefship, and elect the
> traditional chiefs to the political offices. In current practice, the
> traditional chiefs are disqualified from standing for election.)
> The Jay Treaty of 1795 recognizes that the Akwesáhsro:non have freedom to
> travel their land on both banks of the river.  The current rule is
> particularly burdensome: an Akwesáhsro:non wishing to return to Cornwall
> Island from Saint Regis must first cross a second bridge into Canada to
> clear customs and pay duty if necessary, and then return to Cornwall
> Island. There have been recurring discussions of placing the Canadian port
> of entry on the US side of the river to avoid this situation.
> There was an earlier query in the thread about government web sites: The
> respective tribal governments maintain Web presence at
> http://www.akwesasne.ca/
> and https://www.srmt-nsn.gov/
> I've refrained from trying to map the situation, not being qualified. (I'm
> an Old White Guy with a trace of Six Nations ancestry,)

I've sent an email to Franklin County GIS asking for current boundaries as
well as any contact he may have with the tribe. Like Paul said, it would be
best if we could get someone from the tribe involved. It will still be
messy but at least someone local is involved.

>From another old white guy - with no trace of any ancestry of any kind


OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch
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