[Tagging] International and UN names

[Minh Nguyen]

Vào lúc 07:00 2022-03-15, Marc_marc đã viết:
> the language used in the name tag is not about the language of the 
> invader. if a Chinese took over the eiffel tower, it would still be 
> name=Tour Effeil until the language of the invader is sufficiently 
> imposed to consider that the name has changed
> 
> the 2 worries I see with name:UN is first that it breaks the logics of 
> the tag (name:language) and then it's that it's unlimited. after UN,
> why not the name according to the arab league ? the orthodox church ?
> the sect of the sun god ?

I don't think the slippery slope argument is applicable here. The United 
Nations is one of two international organizations with their own ISO 
3166-1 alpha-2 code, the European Union being the other (EU). This is 
why, for example, 🇺🇳 appears as a UN flag emoji on many modern systems.

I agree that name:UN:fr is an awkward construction that's likely to be 
misunderstood by data consumers, but int_name:fr isn't the only alternative.

The name:<language code> syntax is of course very well-established, but 
formally it isn't just for bare ISO 639 codes; it technically allows any 
valid IETF language tag (also known as BCP47). [1][2] pt-BR is an 
example of a language tag meaning Brazilian Portuguese, and es-419 means 
Latin American Spanish. Some place names differ between these dialects.

Meanwhile, some features in the South China Sea are tagged with both 
name:zh-CN and name:zh-TW due to a geopolitical dispute between the PRC 
and ROC, though there's literally no neutral name in some of those disputes.

It follows that name:fr-UN would be for the name in French as used by 
the United Nations. Hypothetically, if the UN and EU were to disagree 
about the usual name of something, both would be "international" names, 
but name:fr-UN and name:fr-EU would be able to distinguish between them.

(Wikidata also has this capability, but it's a bit more convoluted. Only 
a limited set of region-qualified codes are supported for labels, so in 
some cases, you'd probably have to add a "name" statement qualified by 
"claimed by".)

 > do you have an example where name:UN:xx differs from name:xx (apart from
 > tag errors of course) ?

Not that I totally agree with it, but relation 60189 is currently tagged:

int_name=Russia
name=Россия
name:en=Russia
name:UN:en=Russian Federation (the)
official_name:en=Russian Federation

Ideally, relation 49915 would be tagged:

int_name=Viet Nam
name=Việt Nam
name:en=Vietnam
name:en-UN=Viet Nam
official_name:en=Socialist Republic of Vietnam

There's some redundancy, but redundant name tags are actually preferred 
in some situations. [3]

[1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Special:PermanentLink/2288660#Issues
[2] 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Special:PermanentLink/2269590#Localization
[3] 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Special:PermanentLink/2288660#Repeating_name_with_language_specific_tag

-- 
minh at nguyen.cincinnati.oh.us