[talk-au] (LONG) Adelaide Highway Classification (was: Highway Classification Issues)

Darrin Smith beldin at beldin.org
Mon Mar 10 13:48:38 GMT 2008


On Tue, 11 Mar 2008 00:28:09 +1100
"Stuart Robinson" <brainwad at gmail.com> wrote:

> > Simply shot down in Sydney by M3 and M6 which are closer than some
> > of the roads you are talking about and cover nearly identical tasks
> > (middle ring route). So will you be removing one of them? No,
> > because they are Metroads, because a non-job-specific definition is
> > labelling those as the routes. The A13 pulls traffic from the NHA20
> > to a completely different part of the city to the road itself, as
> > do the M3 and M6 when you look at them in detail.
> 
> I don't agree with metroad 6 personally... but the reason for them is
> that it is allegedly a through route from wollongong to newcastle,
> whereas metroad 3 is a ring road around sydney from the southern
> suburbs to the northern beaches. the signed focal points of the
> routes are different to reflect this.

Exactly, just because you don't agree with them doesn't mean you
eliminate them, yet you are suggesting we do that very thing...

It's NOT consistent.

> > We are trying to work out a similar thing in Adelaide. As soon as
> > you don't have a definite thing you start getting arbritary
> > definitions like "50km in length"  why not "60km in length" oh,
> > that would drop another 3 of yours off the list and it wouldn't be
> > some comprehensive. What makes 50km special?
> 
> nothing, provided the route is genuinely a long-haul route and not
> just serving local traffic. its just a highway of 10 or 20 km is
> unlikely to be a long-haul route.

But by this definiton 3/7 of the routes you list below are completely
invalid and should be removed. This is again what I'm getting at, we
either have a too generous definition (All A Routes, which at least is
consistent) or we're inconsistent or we take it to the other extreme and
in that case Adelaide has the A1 north, the M1 and the A20. no other
roads in Adelaide match the definitions you are tyring to put forward.

> thats debatable: port wakefield road to port augusta, main north road
> to sydney,  ne road to ne,  glen osmond road to melbourne,  south
> road  to south, anzac hwy to sw, port road to port adelaide. there
> you go, that's your radial trunk roads. google classifies those as
> its "major highways", so it doesn't seem unreasonable.

Oh, leave out the western suburbs/airport area...
And lets not forget the several routes directly east into the hills
that run for 50+ km to a number of towns on the Murray...
Then there's the DIRECT south path, South road really servers the deep
south-east, there's an easily defined route down Unley road and further
south to Goolwa that's easily long enough... and it's a radial link..
and size doesn't matter.. and it's quite heavily trafficed...
And lets not forget Anzac Highway and Port Road are barely 10k long so
they have to go....
And really, NE Road just ends up looping back to A20 before it even
leaves the proximity of the city so that's not really a through route...

It's NOT consistent.

> > Using Sydney as a typical example for this doesn't cut it, Melbourne
> > matches a lot closer and it has a density of trunk routes similar to
> > Adelaide.
> 
> Except that the definitions on the roads tagging page was originally
> written for Sydney, and so its the archetypal example of how to apply
> them.

Well I'm suggesting they are not appropriate for other cities in
Australia or are you going to tell the Melbournites, Perthites and
Brisbanites that some of their trunk roads aren't appropriate either?
You definitions don't match various roads in each of those cities that
are trunks either... 

I'd be quite happy to go with Auslink = trunk, A's = primary, B's =
secondary or something similar (which really matches the UK definition
better) if I saw it in place everywhere...

What you are essentially saying is that references mean nothing (despite
Ian's statement to the contrary) and it should all be based on what the
most assertive person in the city thinks is right I suppose?

It's NOT consistent.

-- 

=b




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