[talk-au] Roadside rest areas tagged as camp sites

Warin 61sundowner at gmail.com
Wed Apr 19 01:57:24 UTC 2017


On 19-Apr-17 11:10 AM, David Bannon wrote:
> Warin, I am not sure I agree.
>
> There are a number of what are officially Rest Areas that are set up, 
> used and officially blessed as camp sites. Now the term "Camp Site" 
> might mean different things to different people. To people with a 
> caravan or motor home, and there are a lot of them, a camp site is 
> somewhere to camp with their caravan or motor home.

These should be tagged as both a rest area and a 'caravan site'.
I have used 'rest areas' for camping .. even where I was not certain of 
the official over night use, when the need arises.
Usually I try to pick my overnight spots .. sometimes things change and 
I have to take what I can get.

>
> I'm sorry (for you) that so many of them are not suitable for a tent 
> but the truth is there is a big demand from caravan (camper, motor 
> home etc) users and an inability to distinguish between sites that 
> make good camp sites and ones that don't would be a problem.

Err OSM does distinguish between camp/tent site and caravan site .. even 
the usually render has different symbols for them.
tourism=camp_site
tourism= caravan_site

Most if not all Australian sites cater for both.  Free sites may only 
cater for one type though.
Where a site is unsuitable for tents .. then it should clearly be tagged 
as a caravan site. And vice versa.

>
> IMHO, we are talking about "camp sites" as somewhere you camp, if it 
> is unsuitable for a tent in your opinion, then a tag saying just that 
> may be appropriate. Importantly, you would be allowed erect a tent, 
> even if you would be uncomfortable doing so.

Some 'rest areas' do not officially allow over night stays. Some have no 
area suitable for driving in tent pegs.

>
> Worth noting that the division between a tent and a caravan is 
> possibly vague, while the majority of campers on the road (excluding 
> xmas and easter time) are in recognizably caravans, there are various 
> "campers" that involve canvas, some where that canvas hits the ground, 
> at what point does that become a tent ?

Caravans like a 'hard standing'.
Tent people like soft ground .. easier to drive in tent pegs as well as 
a softer surface.
An area that gets used by caravans gets the soil compressed to such a 
degree that it becomes very difficult to drive in tent pegs .. sometimes 
I feel I should be carrying a drill to make a hole first. :)

I have re-tagged this one ..
Node: Sutton Park Rest Area (1811197082)
as there should be no overnight here ...
https://www.caravancaravan.com.au/entity/sutton-park-rest-area/nsw

It does look suitable for both tents and caravans. But officially no. 
See how that goes?

I do think these things probably predate the rest area tagging and 
probably the caravan tagging too.
Changing them to rest area tagging is, I think, more appropriate as that 
is what they are officially.
Some have water, toilets .. those can be additional tags as can the 
caravan/camping information.

>
>
> On 19/04/17 08:54, Warin wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>> I have seen a few roadside 'rest areas' tagged in OSM as camp sites.
>>
>> At least some of these are not suitable for pitching a tent .. so 
>> they are not camp sites.
>>
>> At best they could be used by a caravan/RV ... but not a tent user (I 
>> am a tent user).
>>
>> If the intention was to indicate there use by caravan/RV then they 
>> should be tagged as 'tourism=caravan_site'.
>>
>>
>> There now exists a tag 'highway=rest_area'. 
>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:highway%3Drest_area
>>
>>
>> I think the tag 'highway=rest_area' should replace those 'rest areas' 
>> now tagged as 'camp sites', this would be closer to the truth.
>>
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>>
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>
>
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