[talk-au] Discussion J: regionalisation of editor presets

[Ben Kelley]

Hi.

A question of clarification:

Are you asking how to change the defaults when you yourself are editing?

Or are you wanting to raise a problem you see with the current defaults?
(This would seem to be a problem you perceive rather than a question.)


- Ben.


On Mon., 7 Oct. 2019, 10:05 Herbert.Remi via Talk-au, <
talk-au at openstreetmap.org> wrote:

> Discussion J: regionalisation of editor presets
> I am now putting the question at the top and bottom of the text.
>
> ## QUESTION
> How can the presets for the editor (ID and JOSM) be changed to the ATG
> default for the ACT when editing paths in this territory?
>
> # The Issue (background)
> What is the cause of the overwhelming inconsistencies between the path
> tags in OSM and the ATG? This was the question from Discussion I
> (6/10/2019). There may be multiple causes. The error seems to be systematic.
>
> ## Human factors and preset design
> One possible systematic cause is that mappers are trusting the preset to
> get it right.
>
> If it looks like a pedestrian path, then the click on the “walking man”
> button in the ID editor. The presumption here is the preset is correct for
> the ACT. This turns out to be a mistake.
>
> If the path looks like it is for bikes then the mapper clicks the blue
> bike. Again, the mapper is trusting the preset to be correct for the ACT
> but it is not.
>
> The preset with the closed approximation to the ATG tags are the “bike and
> pedestrian” button (noted in Discussion D), which is the least favoured of
> the three in the ACT (try it for yourself in overpass turbo).
>
> ## ID editor preset values
> The ID editor has the following tag values for presets. None are correct
> according to the ATG for the ACT. Pushing any of these buttons will fill
> the OSM database with the wrong data for the ACT.
>
> Foot Path preset (symbol "walking man“)
> tags:
> - highway=footway
>
> Cycle Path preset (symbol blue bike)
> tags:
> - highway=cycleway
>
> Cycle & Foot Path preset (symbol blue bike)
> tags:
> - cycleway=highway
> - foot=designated
> - bicycle=designated
>
> ## accumulating tags assumption
> One mapper has suggested in this forum that the tags accumulated when you
> click multiple buttons, one after another. This assumption may be widely
> held but is also incorrect.
>
> The actual behaviour of the ID editor is quite different. Push the buttons
> in any sequence and the tags of the new preset overwrite the tags that the
> previous button had put on the "way". Tags are overwritten and not
> accumulated. (Lifecycle tags accumulate a history.)
>
> ## The default is king - proven again and again
> Studies have shown that people will stick with the default option 85% of
> the time. In the studies, an alternative option is offered but nobody ever
> clicks on it. This is human nature (psychology). People prefer to go with
> the default.
>
> For the ID editor, this is problematic. The three preset buttons discussed
> have default tags and the editor does not offer to the mapper to change
> them. I doubt most people would think to do so.
>
> The presets in the editor have become the defacto STANDARD, replacing
> anything that might be found in the ATG. The ATG is ignored in preference
> for a default chosen by the editor developer. The outcome is a systematic
> skew of the data in OSM to preset values (verify it yourself in overpass
> turbo).
>
> ## changing the preset to be ATG conform for each state/territory
> One option is to change these three presets to conform with the ATG and
> ACT standard values for “type A” and “type B” paths (see Discussion D).
> Both these types are a Cycle & Foot Path but may have a different
> appearance. Cycle Path and Foot Path would take on the ATG default for
> cycle ONLY path and pedestrian ONLY path respectively. The mapper may need
> to be reminded that the Cycle & Foot Path is the default for the ACT.
>
> Another option would be to set the Cycle Path and Foot Path with the ATG
> and ACT standard values for “type A” and “type B” paths (see Discussion D).
> The advantage of this is that we don’t require the mapper to change their
> behaviour. For the mapper, it is business as usual. Over time the OSM data
> will be corrected through the mappers' habit of toggling each other's work.
> The whole OSM data set for paths in the ACT will be overwritten and it will
> become largely correct. We would go from 95% incorrect to mostly correct. A
> big improvement.
>
> ## QUESTION
> How can the presets for the editor (ID and JOSM) be changed to the ATG
> default for the ACT when editing paths in this territory?
>
> I welcome your comments.
> Keywords: Australia, ACT, ATG, ID editor, presets, paths, root cause
> analysis
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>
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