[talk-au] First Nations flags?

Mon Dec 13 05:38:33 UTC 2021

I may be nit-picking, but (as I understand it) the Australian Aboriginal Flag and Torres Strait Islander Flag have been recognised as the flags of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people of Australia and as flags of significance to the Australian nation and thus been appointed by proclamation of the Governor General as flags of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander peoples respectively, but NOT National Flags.

The Flags Act 1953 https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/C2008C00376 declares only one National Flag - the 'blue flag"
"The blue flag ... is declared to be the Australian National Flag."

The Governor-General may, by Proclamation, appoint such other flags and ensigns of Australia as he thinks fit, and has done so as below:

Proclamation under the Flags Act 1953 (Australian Aboriginal Flag): https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/F2008L00209
"acting with the advice of the Federal Executive Council and noting the fact that the flag ... is recognised as the flag of the Aboriginal peoples of Australia and a flag of significance to the Australian nation generally, appoint that flag, ... to be the flag of the Aboriginal peoples of Australia and to be known as the Australian Aboriginal Flag..."

Proclamation under the Flags Act 1953 (Torres Strait Islander Flag): https://www.legislation.gov.au/Latest/F2008L00210
" acting with the advice of the Federal Executive Council and noting the fact that the flag ... is recognised as the flag of the Torres Strait Islander people of Australia and a flag of significance to the Australian nation generally, appoint that flag ... to be the flag of the Torres Strait Islander people of Australia and to be known as the Torres Strait Islander Flag..."

The flags are undoubtedly of significance and represent their respective peoples, but they don't meet the description from the OSM wiki for flag:type=national being "the main civil flag of a nation", and have not been declared by the Flags Act 1953 to be such.

I second the suggestion of flag:type=indigenous - none of the other already defined flag:types really fit.

Cheers
Mark

> -----Original Message-----
> From: talk-au-request at openstreetmap.org <talk-au-
> request at openstreetmap.org>
> Sent: Monday, 13 December 2021 3:31 PM
> To: talk-au at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Talk-au Digest, Vol 174, Issue 13
> 
> Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to
> 	talk-au at openstreetmap.org
> 
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> 	https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> 	talk-au-request at openstreetmap.org
> 
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> 	talk-au-owner at openstreetmap.org
> 
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re:
> Contents of Talk-au digest..."
> 
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. Re: First Nations flags? (Graeme Fitzpatrick)
>    2. Re: First Nations flags? (Graeme Fitzpatrick)
>    3. Re: First Nations flags? (Warin)
>    4. Re: First Nations flags? (Phil Wyatt)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 08:34:00 +1000
> From: Graeme Fitzpatrick <graemefitz1 at gmail.com>
> To: Andrew Davidson <theswavu at gmail.com>, OSM-Au
> 	<talk-au at openstreetmap.org>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAP4zaXr8EBHOeyM9ZQLA0=CTFASH0GAg7Sg9EZAGcM2rpmoLDw@
> mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> On Sun, 12 Dec 2021 at 17:23, Andrew Davidson <theswavu at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> >
> > flag:name=Australian Aboriginal
> > flag:wikidata=Q1285625
> >
> > flag:name=Torres Strait Islander
> > flag:wikidata=Q462621
> >
> 
> Thanks for that info, Andrew.
> 
> & after a bit more searching last night, it turns out that they have both been
> proclaimed as Australian National Flags, which I wasn't aware of.
> 
> It's going to be interesting to see how it works when / if flags start being
> rendered?
> 
> I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Graeme
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-
> au/attachments/20211213/3d2939ee/attachment-0001.htm>
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 12:53:13 +1000
> From: Graeme Fitzpatrick <graemefitz1 at gmail.com>
> To: Andrew Davidson <theswavu at gmail.com>, OSM-Au
> 	<talk-au at openstreetmap.org>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAP4zaXp54iiyf4TKfH0DS6doMPEUc7c3t_V8WLUdQoybB-
> u3Ug at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 at 08:34, Graeme Fitzpatrick <graemefitz1 at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> >
> > I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.
> >
> 
> & done:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Australi
> an_Flags
> 
> Having troubles with the example images of the Aboriginal & Torres Strait
> Islander flags though?
> 
> They're both listed in Wikipedia
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_recognise
> d_under_the_Flags_Act_1953,
> but when I tried to link to those images, it appears that they don't really exist?
> 
> Could somebody who actually knows what they're doing around the wiki
> please have a look at them? :-)
> 
>  Thanks
> 
> Graeme
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-
> au/attachments/20211213/d0702746/attachment-0001.htm>
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 14:50:12 +1100
> From: Warin <61sundowner at gmail.com>
> To: talk-au at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?
> Message-ID: <dfb9d54c-eb81-e230-3e34-99dff7a647a6 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
> 
> There is a claim of copyright ob the Aboriginal flag.. (foolish if you ask me)...
> 
> Oh and also the Torres Strait Islander one too... (sigh)
> 
> 
> Both are listed as copyright on wikipedia.
> 
> So those are out for OSM?
> 
> 
> On 13/12/21 1:53 pm, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 at 08:34, Graeme Fitzpatrick
> > <graemefitz1 at gmail.com <mailto:graemefitz1 at gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> >
> >     I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.
> >
> >
> > & done:
> > https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Aust
> > ralian_Flags
> > <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Aus
> > tralian_Flags>
> >
> > Having troubles with the example images of the Aboriginal & Torres
> > Strait Islander flags though?
> >
> > They're both listed in Wikipedia
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_rec
> > ognised_under_the_Flags_Act_1953
> > <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_re
> > cognised_under_the_Flags_Act_1953>,
> > but when I tried to link to those images, it appears that they don't
> > really exist?
> >
> > Could somebody who actually knows what they're doing around the wiki
> > please have a look at them? :-)
> >
> > ?Thanks
> >
> > Graeme
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Talk-au mailing list
> > Talk-au at openstreetmap.org
> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-
> au/attachments/20211213/c2195d17/attachment-0001.htm>
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Mon, 13 Dec 2021 15:30:20 +1100
> From: "Phil Wyatt" <phil at wyatt-family.com>
> To: "'Warin'" <61sundowner at gmail.com>,	<talk-
> au at openstreetmap.org>
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?
> Message-ID: <004401d7efda$267b6910$73723b30$@wyatt-family.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
> 
> That?s correct on all fronts
> 
> https://aiatsis.gov.au/explore/aboriginal-flag
> 
> https://aiatsis.gov.au/explore/torres-strait-islander-flag
> 
> https://www.naidoc.org.au/about/indigenous-australian-flags
> 
> 
> 
> Might have some luck with Torres Strait Island Regional Council in getting
> permission to use
> 
> 
> 
> From: Warin <61sundowner at gmail.com>
> Sent: Monday, 13 December 2021 2:50 PM
> To: talk-au at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [talk-au] First Nations flags?
> 
> 
> 
> There is a claim of copyright ob the Aboriginal flag.. (foolish if you ask me)...
> 
> Oh and also the Torres Strait Islander one too... (sigh)
> 
> 
> 
> Both are listed as copyright on wikipedia.
> 
> So those are out for OSM?
> 
> 
> 
> On 13/12/21 1:53 pm, Graeme Fitzpatrick wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Mon, 13 Dec 2021 at 08:34, Graeme Fitzpatrick <graemefitz1 at gmail.com
> <mailto:graemefitz1 at gmail.com> > wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> I'll update the Oz Guidelines to include this info.
> 
> 
> 
> & done:
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Australian_Tagging_Guidelines#Australi
> an_Flags
> 
> 
> 
> Having troubles with the example images of the Aboriginal & Torres Strait
> Islander flags though?
> 
> 
> 
> They're both listed in Wikipedia
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Australian_flags#Other_flags_recognise
> d_under_the_Flags_Act_1953, but when I tried to link to those images, it
> appears that they don't really exist?
> 
> 
> 
> Could somebody who actually knows what they're doing around the wiki
> please have a look at them? :-)
> 
> 
> 
>  Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> Graeme
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Talk-au mailing list
> Talk-au at openstreetmap.org <mailto:Talk-au at openstreetmap.org>
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
> 
> -------------- next part --------------
> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-
> au/attachments/20211213/651e2afa/attachment.htm>
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Subject: Digest Footer
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Talk-au mailing list
> Talk-au at openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> End of Talk-au Digest, Vol 174, Issue 13
> ****************************************