[talk-au] Assistance with ongoing disagreement regarding intersections

[Brendan Barnes]

I do see on
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Lanes#Motorway_with_lanes_and_destinations,
at least in a motorway context, it is to be mapped as one way until there
is a physical separation, which at that point it separates into separate
ways. Although it specifically describes motorways, I don't see why the
same style wouldn't apply to primary and lesser-grade roads (but please
correct me if I've missed something!)

Also on https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Dual_carriageway it says don't
map as two carriageways if it's just a paint or other non-physical barrier.

But I'm keen to hear some clarification on the mapping style. In the past,
I myself used to branch-off right turn lanes as their own way. But back
then it seemed to be the abundant style in the Australian areas which I
contributed, so I just continued mapping the same way.

If the "no separate way for painted turn lanes" is the agreed style for the
community, I'm happy to assist in fixing some. But it will be a lot of work
to standardise, and ensure the many complex intersection relations are
preserved.


On Fri, 4 Mar 2022 at 16:33, Dian Ågesson <me at diacritic.xyz> wrote:

> Hello,
>
> I'd like some assistance resolving a disagreement I'm involved with
> regarding the correct mapping of dual carriageways at intersections. I have
> previously mentioned this topic on the mailing list here:
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/2021-September/014968.html
> <https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/2021-September/014968.html,>
> .
>
> To summarise briefly, a very active contributor prefers to model dual
> carriageway intersections in a manner that I don't believe is correct.
>
> Turn lanes are split from main carriageways at the start of the new turn
> lane, then cross over each other in an "X" shape, rather than a Box shape
> that I've seen documented. (Examples, because I am bad at explaining: Burwood
> Hwy/Mountain Hwy <https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/8917929878>, Smith
> St/Dandenong Rd <https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2951838115/history>, Burwood
> Hwy/Dorset Rd <https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/8925914559/history>, Princes
> Hwy/William Rd <https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/779286918/history>)
> Additional highways are introduced for left hand turns where there is no
> physical separation (eg, Mt Dandenong Tourist Rd/Mountain Highway
> <https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/113685299/history>, Greville St
> N/Sturt St <https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/976666655/history>, Glenleith
> St/Church St <https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/75040109/history>). This
> editor has been an extremely active contributor for many, many years: I
> found these examples by just zooming in on a given town or suburb, found
> intersection that was modelled this way, and checked the history to confirm
> the source.
>
> I initially engaged with the user in September (111051481
> <https://openstreetmap.org/changeset/111051481>), and after some initial
> delay, we have engaged in a productive conversation
> <https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=206929&commented>
> since. To the user's credit, they have been patient and understanding in
> our interactions, and have made adjustments to their mapping style based on
> my feedback. Unfortunately, we have reached a fundamental point of
> disagreement <https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/118038711>, and I
> don't believe further changeset discussions are going to be productive.
>
> I'm now a little too close to this discussion to be objective, and I would
> really appreciate some assistance with this disagreement. Due to the
> extraordinary output of this user, simply avoiding editing in similar areas
> isn't going to be practical. But am I incorrect in my assessment of
> intersection modelling? Is this a question of style, or of accuracy?
>
> Kind Regards,
> Dian.
> _______________________________________________
> Talk-au mailing list
> Talk-au at openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
>
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