[Talk-ca] new brunswick mappers

Connors, Bernie (SNB) Bernie.Connors at snb.ca
Wed Aug 11 15:38:22 BST 2010

Richard and Sam,

	Thanks for your interest in New Brunswick's data.  I want to simplify the issue of which data is covered by the unrestricted use license agreement.  All of the data that is available for download from the SNB "Geographic Data and Maps" (GDAM) website is covered by the unrestricted use license agreement.  Users must agree to the terms of the license agreement with each download.  The website is available in both French and English.  The address for the GDAM website is:


	*Some* of the data that is viewable in the GeoNB Map Viewer (http://geonb.snb.ca/geonb/) is not covered by the unrestricted use license agreement.  Most of the data in the GeoNB Map Viewer comes from the GDAM website but not all of it.

The following data can be downloaded from the GDAM website: http://www.snb.ca/gdam-igec/e/2900e_1.asp

* Digital Topographic Data Base (1998) - topo maps and elevation data, includes 1999 road network data
* New Brunswick Atlas, Second Edition - Scanned pages of NB Atlas in PDF format, each page represents an NTS 1:50000 map sheet
* Provincial Themes - various administrative boundaries, last updated in 2004
* Reference Indexes and Maps - various map grids
* Orthophoto - 1 metre, colour orthophotos, leaf on, with collection dates from 1996 to 2002
* Civic Address Data Base - a relational database with coordinates stored in a table, updated monthly.
* Digital Property Maps - property boundary lines and Parcel ID numbers, updated in April and October.

All of these data sets use the NB Stereographic Double Projection (EPSG code:2953)
FAQ: http://www.snb.ca/e/6000/6904e.asp

We also provide a few utilities and user guides including NBGeoCalc for coordinate transformations: http://www.snb.ca/gdam-igec/e/2900e_2.asp

If you have any questions about the content of the data please contact me.
Best regards,
Bernie Connors, P.Eng
Service New Brunswick
(506) 444-2077
45°56'25.21"N, 66°38'53.65"W

-----Original Message-----
From: talk-ca-bounces at openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-ca-bounces at openstreetmap.org] On Behalf Of Richard Weait
Sent: Tuesday, 2010-08-10 22:19
To: Talk-CA OpenStreetMap
Subject: Re: [Talk-ca] new brunswick mappers

On Tue, Aug 10, 2010 at 3:03 PM, Connors, Bernie (SNB)
<Bernie.Connors at snb.ca> wrote:
[ ... ]
>        I would really like to see a mapping party in NB but I don't have the time or expertise in OSM to organize one.  I also have a bit of a conflict.  I work for Service New Brunswick - the lead agency for geomatics in NB.  We are currently trying to get a project started to map the NB road network to the NRN data model.  If I invest too much time in OSM it could be perceived as counterproductive to our New Brunswick Road Network (NBRN) project.

Hi Bernie!

You might find it worthwhile to "facilitate" a regular meeting of OSM
enthusiasts without the additional organizational requirements of a
mapping party.  I do this for meetups in Toronto and
Kitchener-Waterloo and my commitment is essentially, "pick a time and
place" followed by "by there and have fun talking about OSM."

The benefit to the OSM community is that only a few will take the time
to organize such an event, but more than a few would be willing to
attend if somebody else organized it.  You are probably saying to
yourself, "Well, sure I would go if somebody else est it up."  And
that kind of proves my point!  ;-)  Our meetups vary from energetic
discussions of OSM related details, to a few regulars catching up on
gossip to meeting newcomers and watching them get more enthusiastic as
they edit the map with an experienced OSMer to encourage them.

Really.  You should do this.

>        We are providing a free online mapping tool called the GeoNB Map Viewer http://www.snb.ca/geonb/.  Please feel free to use the maps here as a reference.  The road data displayed in the GeoNB Map Viewer comes from several sources and is not one homogeneous dataset.  *Most* of the data displayed in the GeoNB Map Viewer is governed by an unrestricted use data agreement: http://geonb.snb.ca/geonb/Agreement_en.pdf

Well this is mixed news.  Mostly nice. ;-)  The map viewer has very
pretty icons.

I did not see any obvious indication of which data is covered by the
above license. Since you say some is under another license I think it
will be important to know the difference.

The license above is pretty good from a municipal data license point
of view.  Some of it still concerns me.  On one hand 3.1 allows
licensee to relicense and sublicense - that's good.  On the other hand
4.5 requires licensee to license others with the same terms.  To my
layman's eyes those seem contradictory.

Also 4.4 requires indemnifying SNB.  If SNB needs to rely on OSMs
funds to protect NB in a legal battle, there is trouble afoot.  ;-)
Of course, OSM is also licensed under terms like as is and no warranty
as well.

SNBs requirement for attribution seems quite reasonable if SNB is the
sole source of data for a map project.  In OSM things work a little
differently.  We expect, over time, that any portion of the map will
have had many contributors, even if a large area came originally from
a single data donor.  So in OSM we expect attribution to the project
as a whole to satisfy all attribution requirements.  Then further
details can be had (for technically acute observers) by way of history
files, and listings on the wiki.  For example, the disclaimers and
attributions of several data donors are shown here.
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Attribution  The form of this
attribution may change over time as there is a practical limit to the
size of a wiki page, but the attribution and disclaimers should
continue to be available, even if in sub-pages.

Do you think that SNB might agree to allow the inclusion of certain of
their databases into OpenStreetMap under the current and future OSM
licenses and Contributor Terms?  That seems quite a lot to ask but it
is also a way to expose the SNB data to a lot of potential users.

This is rather more license-talk than I had hoped to have tonight.

>        I would really like to see some OSM presentations at the upcoming Geomatics Atlantic Conference in Fredericton, Oct 28 and 29.  The call for presentations has been extended:  http://www.geomaticsatlantic.com/call-for-papers

I had a look at that but have a pretty busy October lined up.  Do you
have an idea for an OSM topic that the delegates would love to hear?
I did an Intro to OSM talk for GIScience a couple of years ago and it
lead to some interesting discussion afterwards.  Would you like to do
the talk and use some of my material (It's generally cc-by)?

Best regards,

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