[Talk-ca] More Google Copying

Sat Feb 27 01:40:41 GMT 2010

Interesting,
For the areas that vreimer is mapping, i dont think that any removal of
existing OSM data is taking place. (so the user isn't being destructive)
Unlike a traditional 'newbie/destructive' mapper, where they would go around
and change things just 'because they can'.   It appears that much effort is
taken place to try to get the best possable map, based on not actually being
there.

In the wiki documentation (i think) it recommends that the practice of
changing 'RD' to 'road', is encouraged, as it is more clear.   Even though
the actual road signs might differ.

...

here's one. ..  http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/21696825/history
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=56.665&lon=-92.649&zoom=11&layers=B000FTFT
the source says 'PGS' ... which is the regular landsat coastline data.

Well, we have asked the user to list sources, and it has been done.  (but
not that frequently).
...
So maybe if someone could message that user again (Richard?), and just ask
to list more sources & more frequently?

Cheers,
Sam

On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 4:40 PM, Adam Dunn <dunnadam at gmail.com> wrote:

> Did some more comparing in Valemount area. There are a large number of
> errors in Valemount for the major webmap companies (more errors than I
> normally see). Here's what I've found, and this time I'm just using the
> person's username because I don't think it's a mystery anymore.
>
> NRN: Birch Street
> Google: Birch (missing street type)
> Bing: Birch Rd
> Yahoo: Birch Rd
> vreimer: Birch Road
>
> NRN: Tamerack Road
> Google: Tamerack Rd (match NRN)
> Bing: Tamarak Rd (e->a and missing c)
> Yahoo: Tamarak Rd (e->a and missing c)
> vreimer: Tamarack Rd (e->a)
>
> NRN: Westridge Forest Service Road
> Google: Westridge FS Rd
> Bing: Cranberry Lake Rd
> Yahoo: Cranberry Lake Rd
> vreimer: Westridge FS Road
>
> NRN: Canoe East Forest Service Road
> Google: Canoe East FS Rd
> Bing: Canoe River Forest Rd
> Yahoo: Canoe River Forest Rd
> vreimer: Canoe River FS Road
>
> NRN: Cedar Street terminates on the north end at 14th Avenue
> Google: Cedar Street continues through from 14th to 13th, even though a
> house is in the way on aerial photos, but Google does not show a name for
> this section of street between 14th and 13th.
> Bing: also extends Cedar Street from 14th through to 13th Avenue, plowing
> right through a house, but does not show a name for Cedar street, yet shows
> the short section between 13th and 14th as being called "14th Ave".
> Yahoo: exact same thing as Bing (I'm beginning to think the Microsoft-Yahoo
> deal is showing up here.)
> vreimer: has Cedar Street 120 meters east of actual position (NRN, Google,
> Bing all agree on longitude location), extends it from 14th through to 13th
> Avenue and keeps the name Cedar Street for entire thing.
>
> NRN: Williams Drive terminates at northeast end at Juniper Street, while
> just northwest is a road called Larch Street coming out of Juniper Street.
> Google: Williams Drive extends past Juniper a couple dozen meters (aerial
> photos show either a service road or private driveway), while Larch Street
> is missing
> Bing: Extends Williams past Juniper, although calls it Rd instead of Drive.
> Also has Larch Street, though shows no name for it.
> Yahoo: same as Bing
> vreimer: Extends Williams Drive past Juniper Street, while Larch Street is
> missing. Position is 150 meters off.
>
>
> Based on Birch, it would appear he's copying Bing. Based on Tamerack, it's
> a mix of misspellings. We can see from Westridge that he's *not* copying
> Bing. Based on Canoe, it appears he's *not* copying Google. Based on Cedar,
> looks like Google. Based on Williams/Larch, looks like Google. In some
> places, position is off, other places it's fine. It looks like he actually
> skipped a major road because of this position confusion (it wouldn't fit in
> where it should).
>
> Adam
>
>
> On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 2:57 PM, Adam Dunn <dunnadam at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I agree with Sam. On the face of it, from the evidence we have, this
>> person isn't doing anything "damaging". Sure, there's a typo, but that could
>> be a mistake. This person isn't just using one copyrighted source, as the
>> new Winnipeg subdivision example has shown. I don't think anybody can tell
>> whether a copyrighted source is being used at all. Maybe it's old versions
>> of NRN mixed with municipal/city data? Maybe he works for a mapping company
>> or some entity that has access to the latest road information? That would be
>> perfectly legit (given the city/company has agreed). This mapper is quite
>> prolific in the system. They have spent many hours mapping roads all over
>> the country. In fact, many hours per day, practically *every* day. It's
>> quite unfortunate that this person has decided not to participate in our
>> discussions. If the sources are not acceptable then it will be quite a large
>> amount of deletion that will need to be done by OSM administrators.
>>
>> Adam
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 1:20 PM, Sam Vekemans <
>> acrosscanadatrails at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I dont think there is actual 'damage'. Its just that we dont know what
>>> the source is for the mapping.
>>> Alot of tracing (and it looks like tracing), there is a few versions
>>> of the NRCan data that it could be from. So its hard to say whats
>>> going on. (quick copying can also resault in spelling erors.
>>>
>>> Sam
>>>
>>> On 2/26/10, Richard Weait <richard at weait.com> wrote:
>>> > On Sun, Feb 21, 2010 at 8:17 PM, Sam Vekemans
>>> > <acrosscanadatrails at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >> Hi,
>>> >> Yup, i just sent off a nice message.  Hopefully it will be recieved.
>>> I'll
>>> >> let you know if i get a responce back.
>>> >
>>> > Sam V. did you hear back from vreimer and these unusual edits?
>>> > Adam D. are you convinced this editor is damaging the map?  Submit
>>> > your evidence to the data working group at data at openstreetmap.org
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
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>>> > Talk-ca at openstreetmap.org
>>> > http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Twitter: @Acrosscanada
>>> Blog:  http://Acrosscanadatrails.blogspot.com
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>>> @Acrosscanadatrails
>>>
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>>
>>
>
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