[Talk-ca] COMS2200 Ottawa, Carleton University

Wed Oct 18 00:50:39 UTC 2017

Greetings OSM Ottawa and Data Working Group;

It looks like all of the COMS2200A photos have been deleted from OSM
Ottawa.  Is that true? When I look at the map, it does look rather
unpopulated with photos.
Can you please confirm?

Sincerely
Tracey

On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 12:46 PM, Tracey P. Lauriault <tlauriau at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Greetings OSM folks;
>
> I wonder if you could assist.
>
> Students are still getting locked out and are unable to complete their
> assignment. Also, the message they are receiving see below states that you
> were unable to locate me, which we know is not the case.
>
> It would be really great if we let the students finish their assignment
> and that we discuss what to do with the messy data as discussed in earlier
> parts of this stream.
>
> Any assistance would be most appreciated.
> Sincerely
> Tracey
>
> "Dear COMS2200A students,
>
> welcome to OSM and we're happy to see you engaging with our shared
> database.
>
> A few of our community members have taken exception to some of the things
> that you mapped and how you mapped them; many of your edits are not exactly
> following the quality standards we have set for us in OSM which leads us to
> believe that you may not have received the requisite training, especially
> where you've made edits outside of the university district.
>
> Sadly we couldn't find out who the person responsible for this
> class/course/ activity is. A few mappers have commented on edits that you
> made, and pointed out errors or problems; this should have triggered
> e-mails to the address used when registering but the messages seem to have
> been ignored.
>
> Could you please inform your teacher/course leader to get in touch with
> the Canadian community on the talk-ca mailing list (
> lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca) so that we can discuss how to
> continue this exercise without degrading OSM's data quality?
>
> Please pause your editing activity until the matter is cleared up.
> Thank you Frederik Ramm OSMF Data Working Group
>
> On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 9:11 AM, Tracey P. Lauriault <tlauriau at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Thank you.
>> Lets finish this assignment and then regroup to discuss whether or not
>> this should be done again next year, and if so the best way to do it.
>>
>> The students will need to put together a small reflection piece on the
>> process, that should help.  We will have identified numerous issues and
>> error types, and we will have learned something about students and the OSM
>> community.
>>
>> I am travelling quite a bit this month, if I am here I will attend the
>> next local.  Please let me know when and where they are.
>>
>> Cheerio
>> Tracey
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 8:30 AM, James <james2432 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I think some people are missing the point of the class by saying: Go map
>>> an african village.
>>>
>>> The point was to have students go outside and take photos of real world
>>> items(surveying) and upload them to mapillary
>>> Then the students take the mapillary photo key and add it to the item in
>>> OSM
>>> They are supposed to learn about deriving information from
>>> something(photo, text,etc)
>>>
>>> As I've said to Tracey, I welcome the project, maybe we will get some
>>> new mappers out of it, but they are new mappers(we all started out new at
>>> one point and we've made errors in the past) and if they can learn from the
>>> feedback; all the better.
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 8:22 AM, john whelan <jwhelan0112 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> This is primarily to Tracey ca-talk has been cced.
>>>>
>>>> There are a number of issues here.
>>>>
>>>> First OSM is growing up.  No longer is it a bunch of mappers who use
>>>> the edit tools or web page to view the map.  The data is live and snapshots
>>>> are taken by various players including OSMAND at points in time.  This can
>>>> be once a month so if there are a small number of mistakes not a big deal.
>>>> If there are a large number in the snapshot then OSMAND users are stuck
>>>> with them until the next off line map is made available.  Because of
>>>> bandwidth costs both to the end user and to OSMAND it can be two or three
>>>> months before the errors are cleared.
>>>>
>>>> Second the email over Frederick's signature is extremely polite for
>>>> Frederick.  He wrote the book on OSM and is part of the group currently
>>>> looking at whether we need a formal policy for handling edits by groups of
>>>> organised mappers.  The DWG working group is the highest central authority
>>>> within OSM and is concerned with data quality or vandalism.  I think the
>>>> Carlton students edits show there is a very definite need.  A number of
>>>> mappers including myself were hoping there wouldn't be a need for something
>>>> quite so formal.  Note to Frederick if you read this change my response to
>>>> the survey.
>>>>
>>>> Third OpenStreetMap is very rich in what can be mapped.  In an urban
>>>> area it can be very complex to map.  For example currently there is a push
>>>> within OpenStreetMap to add more information for the disabled.
>>>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Disabilities but exactly how one
>>>> adds tactile_paving = yes correctly is something I still have to work
>>>> out.  The City of Ottawa is currently adding  tactile_paving at many
>>>> road junctions and for blind people it is very useful as many junctions now
>>>> have slopes rather than curb stones which makes it difficult to know where
>>>> the edge of the sidewalk is for a blind person.
>>>>
>>>> In general I'd start students mapping either on a test server or on a
>>>> HOT project but it would need thinking about which one to map.  Adding
>>>> information for the disabled would also work in that it adds value and is a
>>>> small subset of mapping.  The HOT projects have a validation process so the
>>>> mapping can be verified and is used to large numbers of students mapping in
>>>> a small area.  Typically they restrict what is requested to be mapped.
>>>> http://tasks.hotosm.org/project/2657 is an example but it would not be
>>>> ideal for 150 mappers at once.  I'd need to discuss with someone such as
>>>> Pete Masters what would be ideal.  It's armchair mapping but that reduces
>>>> the number of variables.  OSM can be edited in many ways.  Unfortunately
>>>> some which use smartphones and GPS are not especially accurate and near
>>>> tall buildings they can be a hundred meters out. I assume
>>>> http://learnosm.org/ was brought to the attention of the students?
>>>> http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Map_Features and taginfo.
>>>>
>>>> It's also interesting in the context of the Statistics Canada building
>>>> project, data quality is important to Stats Canada and one reason I felt
>>>> the original project was at risk of not being a success was the possibility
>>>> that a large number of new mappers would be difficult to train.  Just
>>>> adding tags onto imported buildings was much simpler and much less error
>>>> prone.
>>>>
>>>> I can probably make myself available to brief the students about
>>>> OpenStreetMap unfortunately I have some domestic issues at the moment which
>>>> rules out the next couple of days.  Bug me if this would be of use.
>>>>
>>>> Cheerio John
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 10 October 2017 at 23:08, Steve Singer <steve at ssinger.info> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 10 Oct 2017, Tracey P. Lauriault wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Greetings OSM mappers;
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> For the benefit of background to others on the list
>>>>>
>>>>> http://www.openstreetmap.org/user_blocks/1560
>>>>>
>>>>> Is an example of the block message that was sent to a bunch of users.
>>>>>
>>>>> (I wasn't involved in asking for or implementing the blocks or have
>>>>> anything to do with the assignment).
>>>>>
>>>>> I haven't looked at the edits in any details but I will make a few
>>>>> general comments
>>>>>
>>>>> 1. If one user comes into OSM and makes a few changes with issues
>>>>> because of misunderstandings or inexperience fixing those changes isn't a
>>>>> big deal. Most of the time someone will just fix them without saying
>>>>> anything.  However if 30 or 300 users make lots of changes in a short
>>>>> amount of time with the same types of errors the volume present
>>>>> challenges.  Large scale edits by a bunch who are doing it as part of a
>>>>> course, or who are employed by a company to make the changes, or who are
>>>>> doing so as part of a coordinated humanitarian effort have the potential to
>>>>> cause problems if they aren't coordinated  carefully.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> 2. A big part of working in any open-source project particularly with
>>>>> OSM is that you need to communicate with the other contributors.
>>>>> Communication is a two way street, some people are better at it then others
>>>>> and it doesn't come naturally to everyone.  I would hope that a course that
>>>>> covered the contributing to open source projects (including open data
>>>>> contributions) covered interacting with the community. If the course only
>>>>> wanted to give students experience with the tools then editing against a
>>>>> test or development instance of OSM would be better.
>>>>>
>>>>> The advise I would give to people new to the open source
>>>>> communities(and at times remind veterans) is believe that most people who
>>>>> are contributing are coming from a place of good intentions and to give
>>>>> them the benefit of the doubt and try to understand where they are coming
>>>>> from.
>>>>>
>>>>> When contributing to an open sourced project you need to take
>>>>> responsibility (as an individual) for your contributions but that doesn't
>>>>> mean they need to be, or will be perfect. No edits are perfect but people
>>>>> need to be willing to listen to and learn from feedback from other members
>>>>> of the community.
>>>>>
>>>>> Steve
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> I understand that students for COMS2200 have been blocked from
>>>>>> posting to OSM.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There was also an unfortunate email sent to Carleton University by
>>>>>> one of your members that is circulating
>>>>>> through the administration from (james2432 at gmail.com).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The data are being contributed as part of an assignment described
>>>>>> here -
>>>>>> https://github.com/TraceyLauriault/COMS2200A
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I understand that the students are making some small and some large
>>>>>> mistakes that may not meet your OSM
>>>>>> data quality standards.  The students are restricted to only be
>>>>>> mapping the Carleton University Campus.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wonder if it might be possible to unlock the restriction to let
>>>>>> them finish the assignment.  They should
>>>>>> be done by next week. There are 150 students.  Once the assignment is
>>>>>> complete I would gladly work with you
>>>>>> to salvage the data, delete some data, repair some data or wipe all
>>>>>> of the data.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We apologize for this inconvenience and hope that you can be
>>>>>> empathetic and allow for the assignment to be
>>>>>> completed so that the students can be assessed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also, perhaps there are a number of common errors and if you identify
>>>>>> them we may be able to fix them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sincerely
>>>>>> Tracey
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Tracey P. Lauriault
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Assistant Professor Critical Media Studies and Big Data
>>>>>> Communication Studies
>>>>>> School of Journalism and Communication
>>>>>> Suite 4110, River Building
>>>>>> Carleton University
>>>>>> 1125 Colonel By Drive
>>>>>> <https://maps.google.com/?q=1125+Colonel+By+Drive+%0D+Ottawa+(ON)+K1S+5B6&entry=gmail&source=g>
>>>>>> Ottawa (ON) K1S 5B6
>>>>>> 1-613-520-2600 x7443
>>>>>> Tracey.Lauriault at Carleton.ca
>>>>>> @TraceyLauriault
>>>>>> Skype: Tracey.P.Lauriault
>>>>>> https://carleton.ca/sjc/people-archives/lauriault-tracey/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Talk-ca mailing list
>>>>> Talk-ca at openstreetmap.org
>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Talk-ca mailing list
>>>> Talk-ca at openstreetmap.org
>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> 外に遊びに行こう！
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *Tracey P. Lauriault*
>>
>> Assistant Professor
>> Critical Media Studies and Big Data
>> Communication Studies
>> School of Journalism and Communication
>> Suite 4110, River Building
>> Carleton University
>> 1125 Colonel By Drive
>> Ottawa (ON) K1S 5B6
>>
>> 1-613-520-2600 x7443 <(613)%20520-2600>
>> Tracey.Lauriault at Carleton.ca
>> @TraceyLauriault
>> Skype: Tracey.P.Lauriault
>> https://carleton.ca/sjc/people-archives/lauriault-tracey/
>>
>
>
>
> --
> *Tracey P. Lauriault*
>
> Assistant Professor
> Critical Media Studies and Big Data
> Communication Studies
> School of Journalism and Communication
> Suite 4110, River Building
> Carleton University
> 1125 Colonel By Drive
> Ottawa (ON) K1S 5B6
>
> 1-613-520-2600 x7443 <(613)%20520-2600>
> Tracey.Lauriault at Carleton.ca
> @TraceyLauriault
> Skype: Tracey.P.Lauriault
> https://carleton.ca/sjc/people-archives/lauriault-tracey/
>

-- 
*Tracey P. Lauriault*

Assistant Professor
Critical Media Studies and Big Data
Communication Studies
School of Journalism and Communication
Suite 4110, River Building
Carleton University
1125 Colonel By Drive
Ottawa (ON) K1S 5B6

1-613-520-2600 x7443
Tracey.Lauriault at Carleton.ca
@TraceyLauriault
Skype: Tracey.P.Lauriault
https://carleton.ca/sjc/people-archives/lauriault-tracey/
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