[Talk-ca] New MapRoulette Challenge - Add Surface to Highways
Justin Tracey
j3tracey at gmail.com
Fri Jan 27 21:45:25 UTC 2023
We don't have to rely entirely on personal experience either: an
Overpass query for [highway=motorway][surface=unpaved] over Canada
returns no results. Same for other high-use unpaved tags on taginfo
(ground, dirt, compacted). It seems pretty definitionally true that if a
road isn't paved in Canada, it's not a motorway.
- Justin
On 2023-01-27 14:57, john whelan wrote:
> I would support Jarek's views here if that helps you see a consensus.
>
> I have yet to come across an unpaved motorway in Canada. We are
> reasonably civilised in the North.
>
> We do have ice roads but they really aren't motorways.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On Fri, Jan 27, 2023, 14:49 David Salmon <David.Salmon at tomtom.com
> <mailto:David.Salmon at tomtom.com>> wrote:
>
> Hi Jarek,____
>
> __ __
>
> It could be difficult for some users to distinguish between specific
> surface types using only aerial imagery alone. Even if there’s
> ground truth data, like Bing Streetside or Mapillary, depending on
> the lighting conditions and image clarity, interpretation could be
> tricky. Flagging a task as Too Hard is an option to cover situations
> where the user can’t confidently make a determination with the
> available source material.____
>
> __ __
>
> However, I don’t sense a consensus yet on the approach of using
> Paved versus a specific surface value. Would you prefer that I make
> the challenge Not Discoverable until there’s time to conclude the
> discussion?____
>
> __ __
>
> Generally the types of leads that TomTom can generate for potential
> updates to OSM are usually incidental but spread across wide areas.
> With that in mind, MapRoulette tends to be a better fit. Although we
> have used HOT Tasking manager at the request of communities too.
> We’re open to tailoring the approach depending on the need.____
>
> __ __
>
> I’m interested in learning more about the history of the fords and
> waterways topic to understand how we can help. Let me know if you’d
> be interested in joining an online meeting to discuss that topic
> further.____
>
> __ __
>
> All the best,____
>
> David____
>
> __ __
>
> __ __
>
> *From:* Jarek Piórkowski <jarek at piorkowski.ca
> <mailto:jarek at piorkowski.ca>>
> *Sent:* Thursday, January 26, 2023 3:11 PM
> *To:* talk-ca at openstreetmap.org <mailto:talk-ca at openstreetmap.org>;
> David Salmon <David.Salmon at tomtom.com <mailto:David.Salmon at tomtom.com>>
> *Subject:* Re: [Talk-ca] New MapRoulette Challenge - Add Surface to
> Highways____
>
> __ __
>
>
>
> You don't often get email from jarek at piorkowski.ca
> <mailto:jarek at piorkowski.ca>. Learn why this is important
> <https://aka.ms/LearnAboutSenderIdentification>____
>
>
>
> Hello David,____
>
> __ __
>
> Welcome to the list, and thank you for the introduction.____
>
> __ __
>
> The task description on MapRoulette says "The goal of this challenge
> is to identify and add missing surface tags on motorways and
> motorway links as they represent high speed roads, and it is
> desirable to accurately tag the surface for these highways."____
>
> __ __
>
> In this specific case, it might be easier to assume in map and
> router applications that all motorways in Canada are paved unless
> tagged otherwise. I am not aware of any exceptions, and if some
> exist, they are probably already tagged as unpaved. I'm seeing an
> analogy to defaulting to oneway=yes on motorways and only tagging
> the ways that are oneway=no.____
>
> __ __
>
> If you are looking for more detail than "paved", can all MapRoulette
> challenge participants reliably distinguish between asphalt,
> concrete, and other types of pavement using aerial imagery?____
>
> __ __
>
> Are you planning on expanding this challenge to other roads, and
> will those be also done using aerial imagery?____
>
> __ __
>
> I am a little skeptical about using MapRoulette to obtain precise
> data like this. I have seen fords wrongly added in southern Ontario
> by MapRoulette users seemingly more eager to solve the task quickly
> than to improve the map. These users displayed little familiarity
> about how roads in the region actually look: crossings of streams
> are overwhelmingly culverts, and many streams are anyway inaccurate
> from an old import, but cleanup takes time, so instead they put on
> the ford tag and moved on. I don't think that kind of challenge
> really helps the map. But maybe we can set up a MapRoulette
> challenge to correct ford crossings on roads in southern Ontario
> that are actually culverts.____
>
> __ __
>
> Curious to hear your thoughts on data quality and how
> MapRoulette-sourced surface information helps OSM and TomTom.____
>
> __ __
>
> Thanks,____
>
> Jarek____
>
> __ __
>
> On Wed, Jan 25, 2023, at 08:03, David Salmon wrote:____
>
> Hello Canada OSM Community,____
>
> ____
>
> I hope that the beginning of 2023 is going well for everyone.____
>
> ____
>
> I’d like to introduce myself - my name is David, and I have
> picked-up the role of TomTom Community Manager for the United
> States and Canada from Courtney
> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.openstreetmap.org%2Fuser%2Fcourtiney%2F&data=05%7C01%7Cdavid.salmon%40tomtom.com%7C80e35a13fd2c40e00d9f08daffd986e2%7C374f80267b544a3ab87d328fa26ec10d%7C0%7C0%7C638103606990259675%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=bfegGrEUTC%2FMuwIQFzv86Vb5DzXZDwsJegGGuIjbAKY%3D&reserved=0>.____
>
> ____
>
> I’m reaching out to inform you that we have created a new
> MapRoulette challenge in order to add Surface to ways in
> Ontario. To detect the issues in this challenge, we used
> Overpass Turbo to select Motorways where the Surface tag was not
> present.____
>
> ____
>
> You can find the challenge here: Canada - Add Surface to Highway
> - January 2023 - Ontario
> <https://eur02.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fmaproulette.org%2Fbrowse%2Fchallenges%2F37420&data=05%7C01%7Cdavid.salmon%40tomtom.com%7C80e35a13fd2c40e00d9f08daffd986e2%7C374f80267b544a3ab87d328fa26ec10d%7C0%7C0%7C638103606990259675%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=97UselFc%2FJIFlRcltF7s2%2BcDNGNJQWq%2Bn3zcCU1z%2FOM%3D&reserved=0>____
>
> ____
>
> In the description of the challenge you can find some additional
> information that will make it easier for you to solve the tasks.____
>
> ____
>
> Do not hesitate to contact me at david.salmon at tomtom.com
> <mailto:david.salmon at tomtom.com> to talk about possible
> collaborations, problems or challenges that you have detected.
> If you want to share them with us, we will be happy to explore
> how we can help.____
>
> ____
>
> In the meantime, happy editing!____
>
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