[Talk-GB] Great North Trail MTB Route

Chris Fleming me at chrisfleming.org
Mon Jul 13 09:03:00 UTC 2020

On 12/07/20 at 02:17pm, Andy Townsend wrote:

  On 12/07/2020 12:32, Adam Snape wrote:

    My main concern here is about whether we should be mapping unmarked
    routes at all and especially whether it is okay to import them
    without discussion or the explicit permission of the copyright

    I'd agree with that.  Generally speaking, even aside from the
    copyright issue, I don't believe that unsigned routes belong in
    OSM.  Where I've personally come across them I've not removed them
    (since someone thought it was valid to add in the first place) but
    have added "name:signed=no" to e.g.
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/6366232 to allow me to filter
    "someone wrote a book once" routes from https://map.atownsend.org.uk
    .  I'd also agree with Richard's point on
    https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/74330916 that this is not a
    general bicycle route and shouldn't be tagged as such.

We have three points to consider, first is this not a NCN - there was
agreement from the user that made the original change to roll back this

Secondly unsigned routes, these aren't necessarily great as they can't
be verified on the ground, and often tend to be informal however they
are useful, I cycled a day of the Capital trail last year and it was
great being able to pull the route out of OSM. My feeling is OK on
these. It would be intesting to know what the consensus is on noting
unsigned - most routes I've seen just use unsigned = yes rather and

The third issue is of copyright, which is the one Adam brought up.
Personally I don't really know about this one. On one hand the route is
made of of ways already existing on OpenStreetMap; does that move us a
step outside of copying from whatever data source was used to derive the

We also have copyright of the route itself, Cycling UK do seem to assert
copyright and therefore we probably do need them to ask them. (It's nice
to see that the cycling UK website does display the route over a OSM
map) but they link externally to OS maps.

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