[Talk-ht] [activation hotosm] Hurricane Matthew response : Imagery/UAV coordination and support to local Haitian UAV capacities
FredM
frmoine at gmail.com
Dim 9 Oct 10:54:58 UTC 2016
I finally took the time to read,
And by the way, I want to send a message to HT talk and OSM Haiti.
We tried our best to continue to run our drone operation to highlight
some problem in Haiti. Since 2012, we tried to find some fund to fly
over Canaan area.
Since 2014 or earlier, international community came in Canaan Area and
we had to stop our mapping party in Canaan. So in 2015 we proposed to
fly over this area to ARC and others to maintain a link with this area.
We asked to cover the cost of the drone and the team.
Our goal is to finalize our methodology, and cover the cost to run a
drone unit in Haiti (it is quite costly) to help other community.
http://potentiel3-0.org/index.php/en/
As I am in Haiti, we can discuss about it ( 36 19 45 44) but again we
spent our own money, and received in 2014 the help of Cartong. We got a
small contract with ARC just now in fact. It help us to pay a new camera
and fix our drone....
But our goal is still the same highlight some problem with accuracy and
find local solution.
So I have tried to make a coordination with hot Tanzania project this
year but I didn't success. At least I have tried....
Right now, we are using drone to find the best warehouse for the
operation in Jeremie, later for the damage assessment. I am volunteer
for the Haitian government for the moment.
All the best and thanks all for the work done for Haiti. And help us to
build local capacity, open mind, it is the most important at the end.
FredM
wrote:
> Great job Fred, glad that you've managed to get things going on your own.
> When if you have the imagery available please feel free to let us know
> and we can make sure it's available on OpenAerialMap.
>
> Stay safe and we wish you the best.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Oct 8, 2016 at 8:34 PM, FredM <frmoine at gmail.com
> <mailto:frmoine at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Oups,
>
> Didn't read all your message. I have seen my name but I don't have
> time for that.
>
> Could you stop to use it as I have no time to cross check what you
> said. Fred can talk for Fred : )
>
> Just came back from an assessment in Jeremie for the gouvernment.
> We have huge work to do. So I am right now with the CNIGS and
> civil protection. In the field we flew drone for planification (
> Warehouse, fix the port, damage assessment, etc...)
>
> Let me know if you have more UAV resource, For now we have 2 ebee
> and 3 quadecopter. + Satellite imagery.
>
> Drone imagery is useful, we are using it in our NGO to promote
> technology and use it for local community. Not for the business or
> the storytelling.
>
> Only for operational purpose,... far away from the "Humanitarian
> circus" or something else.
>
> All the best FredM
>
>
> On 09/10/2016 01:58, Dale Kunce wrote:
>> Hey everyone,
>> First thanks to everyone that has contributed to the base mapping
>> thus far. Many humanitarian groups including the Red Cross,
>> Canadian Military, and the UN. I would much rather be mapping
>> than responding to the copious emails but I wanted to try and end
>> the discussion so we can get back to mapping.
>>
>> There has been a lot of chatter about UAV imagery the disaster
>> imagery charter on the list serve with many accusations flying
>> back and forth. I in my role as the activation lead for Hurricane
>> Matthew, Vice-President of HOT, and GIS Lead for the American Red
>> Cross see no value in trying to coordinate UAV use in Haiti. As
>> has been said by Blake and Cristiano both of whom know more about
>> this subject than I HOT should focus on the things we do best and
>> leave coordination of UAV use and operation to UVAviators.
>>
>> Yes HOT in 2010 was different and HOT members took extraordinary
>> measures to update the map for humanitarians. Due largely to
>> those efforts and later ones in the Philippines, West Africa,
>> Nepal, and many others HOT has become a trusted source of map
>> data immediately following a disaster. Groups like the ones
>> mentioned above have deeply integrated into their work and trust
>> HOT and its amazing volunteers to provide the map data. One of
>> the reasons HOT is trusted is because of our consistency. We
>> provide a very reliable service without causing a lot of drama
>> for the large humanitarian organizations. Throughout my time
>> responding to disasters over the last few years consistency is
>> paramount during large scale disasters.
>>
>> Comparing the airspace and subsequent use of UAVs in Tanzania,
>> during normal "blue skies" times to the crowded chaotic airspace
>> in Haiti shows a lack of basic understanding of the complexity of
>> modern humanitarian operations. If I were empowered, which I'm
>> not even close to being able to do, to simply put someone in a
>> car or on a helicopter and send them into the affected areas I
>> wouldn't. Given the reports from the area from UN, Red Cross, and
>> other NGOs I would send food, water, and shelter kits.
>>
>> HOT has declined to support Fred's effort not because we don't
>> think he has the capability but rather because HOT should and
>> must be consistent in our work. In fact, Fred flies drones
>> professionally and is currently under contract to fly a drone
>> mission in Canaan for American Red Cross prior to Hurricane
>> Matthew, hence he was in Haiti during the storm. We must
>> understand our place during large scale international disasters,
>> we must know the limits of our work, and we must not put the
>> organization at risk without ample time to study and think about
>> those risks.
>>
>> Lastly, as things have changed in disasters in the last few years
>> the need to activate the imagery disaster charter has largely
>> gone away. HOT has fantastic relationships with imagery providers
>> and governments. All are often happy to provide imagery when they
>> are capable of doing so.
>>
>> If you would like to contribute to the current mapping in Haiti
>> please grab a task at http://tasks.hotosm.org
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 8, 2016 at 3:00 PM, Cristiano Giovando
>> <cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org
>> <mailto:cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org>> wrote:
>>
>> Nicolas,
>>
>> As you well know HOT's strength is in pre-event baseline
>> mapping. We
>> have done some damage assessment and post-disaster mapping in the
>> past, but it's not easy and with controversial results.
>>
>> That being said, I'm sure other responding organizations who
>> request
>> HOT baseline mapping support may still find it useful to have
>> high
>> resolution imagery of post event areas, although limited to
>> the range
>> of a small UAV. I'm not in a position to speak for them.
>>
>> Again - and I'm asking you personally, please - please let's
>> avoid
>> confrontation, insinuations, and bring up past arguments. It's
>> absolutely not the time. If you care about Haiti and HOT,
>> please try
>> to engage with this community with a constructive, positive
>> and humble
>> approach. Long emails take effort and thinking, which now
>> would be
>> much better spent in actually doing (mapping?).
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Cristiano
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 8, 2016 at 11:55 AM, nicolas chavent
>> <nicolas.chavent at gmail.com
>> <mailto:nicolas.chavent at gmail.com>> wrote:
>> > Hi Blake,
>> >
>> > Yes Fred and the Haitian dronists on the ground have skills
>> and extensive
>> > experience but little resources to keep up their work; this
>> did not prevent
>> > them from doing what they are good at. This can limit the
>> span of their
>> > action at a time where humanitarian actors need local
>> capacities to generate
>> > post disaster UAV imagery as well as satellite imagery to
>> carry out post
>> > disaster needs assessment. Support to their work can span
>> from small
>> > logistics support (rides in UNHAS, helis, plane and cars).
>> This is quite
>> > common to get such support in any sudden onset disaster
>> responses when
>> > GIS/UAV resources (leading to high impact for IM and
>> decision making)
>> > already undersized are rare, too rare.
>> >
>> > When HOT started its first field missions, we were exactly
>> in the same
>> > situation as Fred. Skilled individuals (less experimented
>> though) with
>> > adequate equipment, but with little operational resources.
>> We did good.
>> > Without the above mentioned forms of support, though our
>> impact would have
>> > been limited and the course of action for OMS in Haiti and
>> in other
>> > countries different.
>> >
>> > With the above in mind, it's weird to read that the
>> president of HOT US Inc
>> > stating that the only HOT US Inc support for Fred and this
>> collective of
>> > local Haitian dronists is only a well known list of UAV
>> groups and a pointer
>> > to UN OCHA. That's of no help.
>> >
>> > UAV are used in Tanzania by HOT US Inc in Development and
>> Disaster Risk
>> > Reduction (DRR) contexts [1]. Thanks to multi years of UAV
>> activities in
>> > Haiti, this country is no longer a terra incognita when it
>> comes to drones
>> > and there is no such thing as "UAV missions in disaster
>> zones with
>> > notoriously complicated airspaces" but an area where it's
>> possible to
>> > operate and make the difference we ought to the Haitians
>> and to the Haitians
>> > mappers/dronists who acquired part of their skills via HOT
>> US Inc and OSM
>> > folks.
>> >
>> > Do we have to understand that HOT US Inc will not help with
>> simple
>> > facilitation work with partner relief organizations working
>> in Haiti, some
>> > of those orgs (ARC, MSF etc) having representatives in the
>> membership or the
>> > Board ?
>> >
>> > Given where HOT US Inc comes from and ironically in Haiti,
>> this would mean a
>> > lot in terms of the losses of our
>> operational/organizational ethos and would
>> > raise questions about the reality of support/empowerment
>> schemes to local
>> > communities or possible conflict of interest between
>> members/Board members
>> > of HOT US Inc and other organizations.
>> >
>> > Best,
>> > Nicolas
>> >
>> > [1] : https://hotosm.org/projects/tanzania
>> <https://hotosm.org/projects/tanzania>
>> >
>> > On Sat, Oct 8, 2016 at 6:42 PM, Blake Girardot
>> <bgirardot at gmail.com <mailto:bgirardot at gmail.com>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Hi Nico,
>> >>
>> >> As you say, you and Fred have extensive experience in Hait
>> and working
>> >> with international partners in Haiti. Fred is actually on
>> the ground
>> >> in Haiti. You and he would be the best to coordinate him
>> flying
>> >> missions.
>> >>
>> >> This is not something HOT does, we do not coordinate or
>> push for UAV
>> >> missions in disaster zones with notoriously complicated
>> airspaces. We
>> >> rely on, and UAV missions need to be handled, by
>> professionals, which
>> >> you and Fred are, so I expect you should be able to handle
>> making the
>> >> proper arrangements and coordinations.
>> >>
>> >> I already suggested who to contact, UAviators, they have
>> coordinated
>> >> UAV missions in disaster zones in the past numerous times in
>> >> conjunction with UN-OCHA. That is HOT's contact, I passed
>> it on to you
>> >> already.
>> >>
>> >> This is all HOT can do, except eagerly anticipate the
>> imagery Fred's
>> >> missions generate.
>> >>
>> >> Regards,
>> >> Blake
>> >>
>> >> --
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>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Nicolas Chavent
>> > Projet OpenStreetMap (OSM)
>> > Projet Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team (HOT)
>> > Projet Espace OSM Francophone (EOF)
>> > Mobile (FRA): +33 (0)6 52 40 78 20
>> <tel:%2B33%20%280%296%2052%2040%2078%2020>
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>> > Email: nicolas.chavent at gmail.com
>> <mailto:nicolas.chavent at gmail.com>
>> > Skype: c_nicolas
>> > Twitter: nicolas_chavent
>> >
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Cristiano Giovando
>> Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Team
>> cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org
>> <mailto:cristiano.giovando at hotosm.org>
>> http://www.hotosm.org
>>
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>>
>> Dale Kunce
>> http://normalhabit.com
>>
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