[OSM-talk-ie] Railways

Sun Feb 14 21:44:26 UTC 2016

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Hi Colm,

Am 14.02.2016 um 21:06 schrieb Colm Moore:
> That other users were doing the same probably suggests what we were
> doing has some logic and that the 'official logic' might not be
> intuitive. So, as I go over the network the next time, do I change
> track=number to passenger_lines=number ?

It is not an "official logic". It is just the logic the tag has. It is a
very bad idea to change the definition of a tag which is already used
very much. tracks=* has been invented back in the old days when OSM was
not allowed to use high-res aerial imagery. ITO maps are a relatively
old service. I joined OSM in mid 2011 and ITO maps have been existing
already at that time.

I think ITO maps is just one of those free services offered by a company
which had been set up years ago and have been just running and never
been changed since that time.

> 4. I will be adding railway:traffic_mode 
> railway=signalrailway=switch
> 
> I have been adding railway=signal and railway=switch but I'm not 
> seeing them on OpenRailwayMap. Does a full scheme need to be 
> defined before they are included?

railway=signal is not enough because there is a huge amount of different
signals. Different due to the differences between railway companies and
countries, different because the serve different purposes.

railway=signal covers (this is no full list):
- - main signals
- - distant signals
- - combined signals (signals showing main and distant signal aspects as
one combined aspect)
- - speed signals
- - distant speed signals
- - route indicators
- - distant route indicators
- - crossing signals (showing if the barriers have been lowered and
everything is ok)
- - etc.

The tagging scheme is an abstract tagging scheme and all useable systems
are derived from that, i.e. all  regional schemes share the keys and
some values but they have differences because signals look different in
Germany and Austria and France and UK and Ireland and and and. (The
German tagging scheme has to cover six different systems of main/distant
signalling from old semaphore over West and East light signals, …)

One huge lack of current signal tagging at OSM is that there is only the
abstract tagging scheme available in English. All "implementations" are
only available in German (Germany, Austria and some thoughts about a
Swiss system) and Finish (Finland).

Even if you do not have a local tagging scheme, you can still add
railway:signal:direction=forward/backward/both and
railway:signal:position=left/right/bridge to indicate direction and
location of the signal relative to the OSM way.

If you need help creating a tagging scheme for Irish signals, just write
me an email and send me a link to the signalling ruleset (I prefer the
official ruleset if public available.)

> To date, the following have been added: http://stat.latlon.org 
> /ie/latest/tags-r.htmlsignal (172)signal_box (13)switch (1063) I 
> suspect that is less than 50% of switches and only 5-10% of all 
> signals have been mapped. 5. Railways in Ireland have timetable 
> numbers, e.g. Dublin - Sligo is timetable 7, but not line numbers. 
> The timetable number isn't very visible, but more visible since 
> www.a-b.ie and and Ireland was added to Google Transit.

Are these timetable numbers numbers which I have to use if I want to
find the timetable of this line at Irelands printed railway guide? If
yes, then these numbers should be mapped as route relations using
route=railway. route=train relations should represent the services. The
German speaking countries have such a timetable number system but
timetable numbering and line numbering are different.

For example, regional express line "RE 1" (North Rhine-Westphalia) runs
from Aachen via Cologne, Düsseldorf, Duisburg, Essen, Dortmund, Hamm,
Soest to Paderborn. It shows up at following timetable sheets:
480 covers trains Aachen–Cologne
415.1 covers trains Cologne–Düsseldorf–Duisburg–Essen (only regional
trains, IC/ICE have a different table)
415.2 covers regional trais Duisburg–Essen–Dortmund–Hamm
430 covers all services Hamm–Soest–Paderborn–Altenbeken–Warburg–Kassel

And it uses following railway lines (from the infrastructure point of
view). These numbers have been assigned by Deutsche Bahn's
infrastructure devision:
2600 Aachen–Cologne Central St.
2633 Cologne Central St.–Colgone Deutz (only trains Aachen→Paderborn)
2639 Cologne Central St.–Colgone Deutz (only trains Paderborn→Aachen)
2650 Cologne Deutz–Hamm
2930 Hamm–Soest
1760 Soest–Altenbeken (only from Soest to Altenbeken9

RE 1 is mapped as route=train, 480/415.1/…. are route=railway,
2600/2633/… are route=tracks. 2600/2633/… are also tagged as ref=* on
the tracks (except siding, yard and spur tracks)

RE 1: https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/1988246
timetable 480: no relation has been created
line 2600: https://www.openstreetmap.org/relation/2656176

> Stations have both station codes, e.g. CNLLY for Dublin Connolly 
> and ticketing numbers (100 for Dublin Connolly). Certain stations 
> and ports also have (British) National Rail codes for ticketing 
> purposes. Station codes seem to be in use on the signalling 
> system.

If station codes are unique of all Ireland (republic), you can tag them
as railway:ref=*.

> Bridge numbers are in the style of UB_ (underbridge) and OB_ 
> (overbridge) with _ being a line letter, e.g. "UBR 52" is the 52nd
>  bridge on the Rosslare line. Older signs will only show the 
> number, e.g. 52. Confusingly, there is a separate system of 
> numbering for restricted bridges: 
> http://www.irishrail.ie/media/bridgeheights1.pdf I don't know why 
> bridge 52 was renumbered 264.

Use bridge:ref=* as there are bridge:name="River XY Bridge" and
bridge:wikipedia=en:River_XY_Bridge.

> 6.> [2] In Germany
>> a railway line has – by definition – only one or two parallel 
>> tracks (outside stations). If there are more than two parallel 
>> tracks outsides stations (e.g. Augsburg–Munich), they are
>> defined as two independent double-tracked railway lines.
> That seems ... strange.  If there are four tracks, do the 
> northbound tracks have one number and southbound the other. Or are 
> the inner tracks one number and the other tracks the other number? 
> On Köln-Düsseldorf, there are **lots** of tracks.

That depends on the situation. Cologne–Düsseldorf is operated like this:
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Line_operation_scheme.svg
Each track pair is independent.
2650 IC/ICE with max. 200 kph, fast regional express trains with max.
160 kph
2670 is used by slow local trains stopping at all stations, max. 140
kph. This line has sometimes only one track.
2324 is only used by freight trains (and has been built by a different
company in 19th century)

Germans would call that Linienbetrieb (at Wikipedia the file is named
line operation scheme but I don't know if this term has just been
invented by a German)

There are also lines which are operated like a real four-tracked line,
e.g. Bietigheim-Bissingen–Stuttgart.
http://www.openrailwaymap.org/?lang=de&lat=48.90402564503796&lon=9.16406
7506790161&zoom=16&style=standard
- From west to east:
regional and freight trains from Bietigheim to Stuttgart (only stopping
in Ludwigsburg)
local trains from Bietigheim to Stuttgart (stopping at every station)
local trains from Stuttgart to Bietigheim
regional trains and freight trains from Stuttgart to Bietigheim

IC/ICE trains only use this line if the high speed line is closed.
Sometimes regional trains use the inner tracks to overtake a slow
freight train.

> I have manually checked every single piece of railway except 
> Belfast Great Victoria Street to Newtownabbey (10km). Does this 
> mean the change can be made (if a mass edit is possible)?

In that case you have checked them.

Best regards

Michael

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