[Talk-us] US Bicycle Routes in KY, TN, AL, MS, and GA

Paul Johnson baloo at ursamundi.org
Mon Mar 11 14:16:49 UTC 2013


Let's not chide people for keeping this discussion on the list in the open
where it belongs.


On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 9:12 AM, KerryIrons <irons54vortex at sbcglobal.net>wrote:

> Alex,
>
> I am in contact with the mappers involved as they have responded to my
> initial message.  This discussion with your mappers group has been very
> constructive.  I am not familiar with your wiki and will look into that.  I
> am not an OSM/OCM mapper but rather involved in the process of developing
> US Bicycle Routes.  I have done some mapping work in Google Maps and am
> familiar with/frustrated by its limitations.  Likewise the MapMyRide
> system.  I am just learning OSM/OCM.
>
> At the risk of repeating myself, the goal is to have coordination and
> communication with the mapper community during the development of US
> Bicycle Routes.  Minh Nguyen's efforts in Ohio with US Bicycle Route 50
> show the kind of collaboration that will be productive for all concerned.
>
> Kerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Alex Barth [mailto:alex at mapbox.com]
> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2013 8:12 AM
> To: KerryIrons
> Cc: Greg Troxel; OpenStreetMap talk-us list
> Subject: Re: [Talk-us] US Bicycle Routes in KY, TN, AL, MS, and GA
>
> > This is a concern about there being no active project to develop a route
> but having a route showing on OSM/OCM.
>
> If that's the situation it seems we have a clear cut case at hand: the
> routes in question just aren't `proposed`.
>
> Kerry - have you reviewed the OSM data in question and tried to get in
> touch with the mapper(s) who created the route?
>
> A clarification on http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:proposed could
> also be in order.
>
> On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 7:53 AM, KerryIrons <irons54vortex at sbcglobal.net>
> wrote:
> Greg,
>
> You have summarized it well.  This is NOT " about having an actual
> published
> proposal and being concerned about it becoming widely available."  This is
> a
> concern about there being no active project to develop a route but having a
> route showing on OSM/OCM.  Minh Nguyen has provided an example of how to
> document a developing route being done by the Ohio DOT.  This is the kind
> of
> communication and coordination we are seeking.
>
>
> Kerry
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Greg Troxel [mailto:gdt at ir.bbn.com]
> Sent: Sunday, March 10, 2013 8:32 PM
> To: KerryIrons
> Cc: 'OpenStreetMap talk-us list'
> Subject: Re: [Talk-us] US Bicycle Routes in KY, TN, AL, MS, and GA
>
> I think Kerry's concern is about "proposed" routes being in the OSM db (and
> renders) when no such proposed routes exist.  Taking a line from wikipedia
> (which I realize is tricky business), we shouldn't be doing original
> research in determining things, but rather documenting things that exist.
> If there are signs and a published route, that's obviously a route.  If an
> organization that is generally viewed as having the authority to determine
> a
> route has published a proposal (which is stronger than 6 what-if
> scenarios),
> then that's fair to be in as proposed.  But as I understand the situation,
> a
> cognizant organization has published a target corridor, not a proposed
> route.
>
> But, this could be about having an actual published proposal and being
> concerned about it becoming widely available, and stopping that doesn't fit
> with OSM norms.
>
> I am also a little surprised about using the OSM database for "what if"
> rendering.  It makes sense to use OSM data as the baselayer, and the
> toolchain for rendering what if, but if there isn't at least a published
> plan for a route (as in "this route is in the state's 20-year plan and
> we're
> working on funding, but if we had money this is what we'd do right now"),
> then putting various things people might want to do in the database seems
> to
> be very far away from verifiable and even not meeting the "accurately
> describe the world" test.  But perhaps I misread some of the earlier
> comments.
>
>
>
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