[Talk-us] Downgrading 'motorways' around toll plazas?

Tue Oct 13 03:56:10 UTC 2015

My 2 mills worth (after inflation):

The Florida Turnpike is a toll road (highway=motorway in OSM) with a
standard 70 mph speed limit that drops to 25 mph a few dozen yards before
the toll plazas (even for SunPass users).  Having driven on it for years, I
would never consider any section of it to be anything less than motorway,
even the low-speed toll plazas.

--jack

On Mon, Oct 12, 2015 at 11:17 PM, James Mast <rickmastfan67 at hotmail.com>
wrote:

> We can unfortunately add two more changesets where Matt1993 has done this
> in the last 24h. [10] [11]
>
> I've sent him a PM about this to come and join us on [talk-us] to talk
> about it, but I bet he's going to 'ignore' it after what he wrote to me on
> a changeset in the last day (he must have just discovered it by luck to be
> honest). [12]  He bashed me as not being 'professional', 'rude' & to send
> him a message (I did, it's called the chanageset comment...).  I waited 6+
> days (others might have only waited 12h or less) before I attempted to fix
> any damage he's done waiting for a response on the changeset (and others
> with him too).... [12] My source for the change was 'common sense/Bing'
> there because I was repairing the routing for bicycle routes as that's part
> of a Bike PA route (as mentioned in the comments of [12]) and I looked at
> the area with Bing (plus I've been there before).  When he converted it to
> a motorway (twice), it broke the bicycle routing in that area.  I was
> repairing the data there and it was a legit changeset comment on my repair
> (links to changesets in comments of [12]).  At least I explain what I'm
> doing in a changeset and don't use a 'generic' comment on all my
> changesets.  Plus, a 'Single interchange doesn't = motorway...'.  If so,
> we'd have several mini motorways segments along US-19 in West Virginia
> between I-79 & I-77, where it's a major 'trunk' highway, but has several
> interchanges sprinkled along it (the only true motorway segments it has is
> from I-77 to it's first interchange (which is where US-19 leaves/joins
> Corridor L) and the bypass segment in the Oak Hill area.  Anyways, several
> other users I talked to agreed with me on this fix for [12] (on and off of
> OSM).
>
> Anyways David, I don't agree with the 'maxspeed:advisory' tag unless the
> speed sign is one of the 'yellow' ones.  I know the toll plaza on the Ohio
> Turnpike on I-76 going into/out-of Pennsylvania uses normal speed limit
> signs.  Thus, those areas should be with the normal 'maxspeed' tag.
> However, I do fully agree with you on the lanes tag.  That's how I did it @
> the Gateway Toll Plaza on the I-76 PA Turnpike. [13]  Could use some more
> fine tuning using the 'turn:lanes' tag however.
>
> -James
>
> [10] - https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/34581064
> [11] - https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/34581478
> [12] - <https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/33674410>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/33674410
> [13] - https://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/40.90417/-80.49574
>
>
> ------------------------------
> From: dwalterc at gmail.com
> Date: Mon, 12 Oct 2015 09:27:05 -0700
> To: gdt at ir.bbn.com
> CC: rickmastfan67 at hotmail.com; talk-us at openstreetmap.org
> Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Downgrading 'motorways' around toll plazas?
>
>
> I also don't think it's reasonable to represent every lane of a toll booth
> as a different way or as trunk. I've also tried to contact this user and
> received no response.
>
> I think a better representation is using the lanes tag and
> or  maxspeed:advisory.
>
> On Sun, Oct 11, 2015 at 7:16 PM, Greg Troxel <gdt at ir.bbn.com> wrote:
>
>
> James Mast <rickmastfan67 at hotmail.com> writes:
>
> > Does anybody think it is a good idea to downgrade 'motorways' around
> > toll plazas to 'trunk' highways?  I just noticed a user did this in
> > mass in NY and MA along I-90/I-87. [1] [2] He's even done this in PA a
> > few times. [3]
>
> No, this is not reasonable.  While one might object philosophically to a
> tollbooth on an Interstate highway, that's the way the world is, and
> noting it as a tollbooth is adequate.
>
> > I've also noticed several problematic changesets this user has done in
> > the past.  I've left several comments on some of his changesets [4]
> > [5] and he's never responded to them except once, and that was after
> > sending him a few PM's (1 per month) till he finally responded only
> > partially to my question in it. [6] That leads me to believe that he's
> > either completely ignoring the e-mails, or he's not even getting them.
> > Also, in that one comment that he did leave (in [6]), he pretty much
> > completely ignored my question (if he had been there and saw shields
> > for this 'new' route since I don't want to delete 'valid' data) and
> > said that he works '12 hour days'.  Honestly, if he can still find
> > time to do big OSM edits and work for 12 hours a day, can't he spare a
> > minute or two to respond to a comment left for him instead of taking 2
> > months to reply?  I mean, even if I was busy and somebody left a
> > comment on a changeset I did, I would try to make a few minutes to
> > respond back within a day or two (week tops) of the comment.  This is
> > a community project and everybody needs to work together and not
> > ignore each other.
>
> I agree that we should have higher expectations of people working within
> the project vs just editing by themselves.
>
> > Another problem with this user is that he almost always keeps using
> > the same changeset comment of "using bing imagery to update map" which
> > is completely useless to tell what he's really doing in each
> > changeset.
>
> I also agree that we should have higher expectations of both
> geographically smaller changesets (except in limited cases where they
> are clearly completely uncontroversial) and more descriptive comments.
> Unfortunately it seems that making edits without being willing to engage
> with others and non-useful changeset comments are correlated.
>
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