[Talk-us] Jefferson Notch Road and latest "GPS made me do it" in the news

Thu Jan 2 13:23:32 UTC 2020

If we're going with access:conditional, it *should* be mode-of-transport
specific.  It's pretty common for closed-in-winter roads to be open to
non-wheeled transport (e.g. skis and snowmachines); the other road I've
lived near (Beartooth Pass, US 212 between Red Lodge and Cooke City,
Montana) falls into the same category. I don't think I ever figured out a
good way to tag it, and while it's since been updated with maxspeed and
lane data, it's not marked as seasonal (among the ways involved:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/454632622#map=15/44.9886/-109.4233&layers=ND).
That road is a particularly interesting case because there's a section
that's closed and gated based on a schedule (but open to over-snow vehicles
and skiers / cyclists / etc) as well as a portion that's not maintained for
winter travel, posted "Road Closed", and regularly traveled (and sometimes
even plowed) by locals until snow gets deep enough to make it impassable
without a tracked vehicle.

Also, is Jefferson Notch Road actually closed to wheeled vehicles in winter
or just not maintained? That's a very important distinction for some
drivers in the late fall and early spring (i.e. before snow depth is
sufficient to make it impassable). winter_service= and access:conditional=
both seem important pieces of data to note, but I'm not opposed to adding
"closed in winter" as an additional part of the name, assuming most data
consumers won't adequately consider access:conditional or winter_service.

On Wed, Jan 1, 2020 at 11:52 PM Zeke Farwell <ezekielf at gmail.com> wrote:

> This looks like something that there still is not consensus on.
>
> Here are couple of roads that are not plowed in the winter in my area of
> Vermont.  Both are tagged differently:
> Lincoln Gap Road: https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/19729533
> VT 108 through Smugglers Notch: https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/48775843
>
> Looks like we have a few different overlapping keys:
>
>    - access:conditional
>    <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Conditional_restrictions&uselang=en-US>
>    - seasonal
>    <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:seasonal?uselang=en-US>
>    - winter_service
>    <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:winter%20service?uselang=en-US>
>
> winter_service=no looks like the simplest option to me, but not knowing
> how the data will be used, the safest bet is probably to put  *"closed in
> winter"* right in the name as is the case with VT 108.  It's not correct
> data modeling, but it will mean people looking at a map are sure to see it.
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 1, 2020 at 10:10 PM Bill Ricker <bill.n1vux at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> > Burlington Family Rescued After GPS Leads Minivan Down Snowmobile Path.
>> BURLINGTON (CBS)
>> > It was an early morning rescue by ATV Sunday in Jefferson, New
>> Hampshire.
>> > ... The family was stranded on Jefferson Notch Road, which is
>> restricted to snowmobiles only during the winter months.
>> > 2 days ago
>> >
>> https://www.boston.com/news/local-news/2019/12/29/burlington-family-stranded-after-following-gps-onto-snowmobile-trail
>>
>> Yeah, I'm not surprised that a road that goes literally through Jefferson
>> Notch isn't plowed in the winter; the road's high point in the notch (aka
>> "col" or "saddle," the diminutive of "pass") is 3,009 feet (917 m), only
>> barely below the height of Mount Mitten (929 m) which the road passes, and
>> lower than Currier Mtn (838 m) just beyond.  Yeah that's not high in young
>> mountains, but at this latitude, that altitude gets plenty snow. I expect
>> even the winter snowmobile path through the notch should be attempted only
>> by parties of multiple experienced operators prepared for mountains'
>> changeable conditions.
>>
>> (I'm guessing the gating/bollards will get upgraded so that only
>> snowmobiles, Cats, and emergency 4WD/6WD even /can/ enter during winter.)
>>
>> In the summer, this road will provide a lovely if challenging shortcut
>> between US 2 and US 302, of which there are precious few in the environs of
>> Mt Washington and the Presidential Range of the White Mountains.
>>
>> OSM - https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/18846225#map=12/44.3103/-71.3696
>> Our way does not (as of this writing) show a tag indicating seasonally
>> variable access.
>> Proposed tag winter_service=no
>> <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/w/index.php?title=Tag:winter_service%3Dno&action=edit&redlink=1>
>> isn't quite strong enough but would be a start.
>>
>> What is the right way to tag a road which is 3 season dramatic automobile
>> mountain short-cut and one-season snowmobile trail?
>>
>>
>> --
>> Bill Ricker
>> bill.n1vux at gmail.com
>> https://www.linkedin.com/in/n1vux
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-- 
Kevin Broderick
ktb at kevinbroderick.com
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