[Openstreetmap] update

[Andy Robinson]

Nicely put Richard. I concur with your thoughts here. 

I am "happy" providing data which creates the OSM database and equally
"happy" to see this data used for whatever anyone wants to use it for,
including me. However I'm also wholly recognising that the service that I am
using in creating the data for OSM (uploading GPS and creating map data in
the database) comes at a price. So in reality I am using a potentially
costly service for free right now.

As the data grows we want to encourage more people to create the data that
OSM holds, it is after all at its core a database of information. We do not
want to discourage anyone from contributing data to this part of the process
and therefore in my view it has to be free and without cost to do so - in
fact there may be arguments to say that OSM should "pay" for some data, even
if that payment is not actually in actual monitory terms.

When it comes to using the data in the database though we need to cover the
cost of storing it and providing it and unless someone is willing to sponsor
the data retention and delivery (very unlikely?) there has to be a
sustainable way of doing so and that means the project has to generate
revenue in some way. The only way to generate revenue as the volume of data
grows is in some way to charge for the volume extracted. That's how I would
see it for a potential commercial use of the data. For non-commercial use I
would expect to be able to get it for free, or at worst on a quid pro quo
basis. Obviously it would be best if we can deliver it free for nc use using
the proceeds of any commercial use licensing.

Steve may have started out with the idea of creating free maps, but he has
always said free as in freedom and I take that to me that it does not
necessarily come without a price.

I have very little knowledge of licensing (software, data or application) so
I'll leave that to those better in the know.

Andy

Andy Robinson
Andy_J_Robinson at blueyonder.co.uk 

>-----Original Message-----
>From: openstreetmap-bounces at vr.ucl.ac.uk [mailto:openstreetmap-
>bounces at vr.ucl.ac.uk] On Behalf Of Richard Fairhurst
>Sent: 10 February 2006 09:10
>To: openstreetmap at vr.ucl.ac.uk
>Subject: Re: [Openstreetmap] update
>
>Hi all,
>
>Oliver wrote:
>
>> If nobody has voiced an opinion on this, then I'll say that cc-nc would
>> make our data much less useful than cc-by-sa
>
>...and others contributed similarly.
>
>I'll set out my personal stall on this first of all. I would ideally like
>OSM
>data to be as public domain as possible. No non-commercial restriction, no
>share-alike restriction, nothing. Just: Here's some great data which we've
>enjoyed making. Go and do wondrous things with it.
>
>But we have a problem.
>
>OSM ain't free to run. Servers, bandwidth, and (inevitably, I think, at
>some
>point) full-time staff: _we_ need to pay for all of them. We need all this
>to
>be able to create and edit the data. But those outside the project who
>might
>want to use the data don't need the technology at all - well, apart
>from enough
>CPU power to download it once. And as the data inevitably, marvellously
>grows,
>this is much more likely to happen.
>
>So we have the weird position where those who make the data could end up
>subsidising those who profit from it. Go figure.
>
>CC-NC is one way around this and I can understand why it's been
>suggested. It's
>also a bit of a blunt instrument, for the reasons Oliver, Lars and
>Christopher
>have suggested. But frankly, there probably is no single licence out there
>that meets our needs.
>
>(IMO, CC licences are for literary/creative works, the GPL is for
>software, and
>neither are suitable for geodata. For starters, we need some serious
>clarity on
>what constitutes a "derivative work" under Share-Alike. Let's say you use
>some
>OSM data in a small map on your website. Do you then have to release the
>content of your whole site under CC-BY-SA?
>
>Or say you do a Google Maps-type mashup of some nice civic information that
>you've scrounged out of the Government - but you place the points on OSM
>data,
>not gmaps. Is this forbidden because the civic data isn't sharealike/PD?)
>
>Maybe we're going about this arse-about-face. Maybe it would be better to
>set
>out what we actually want our licence to do, _then_ decide which one
>best meets
>our needs - or (whisper) write our own.
>
>cheers
>Richard
>
>
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