[OSM-talk] Prolification of the amenity tag
Joerg Ostertag (OSM Munich/Germany)
openstreetmap at ostertag.name
Wed Nov 29 12:11:09 GMT 2006
On Wednesday 29 November 2006 10:48, bvh wrote:
> While this mail has been triggered by the proposal for
I think amenity=wifi is a little bit special here. Lets discuss this in a
> it is more about the amenities tag in general and
> that is why I bring it up here instead of on the wiki.
Thanks for bringing this (at least to my) up here.
> My take on the amenities tag is that recent proposals have drifted to
> uses that are better served outside the openstreetmap database.
Well I don't think this way. More below.
> For starters a (maybe) trivial conclusion : we do not want to tag
> everything that has a location (even if we could).
I think we should tag everything we could, and even more if we can.
> So the question is where do we draw the line?
I think this has to be answered by everyone individually.
> My take on it is that we should try to tag everything that is needed
> to find your way (the purpose of a map, no?)
And even this can be totally different for almost everyone contributing to
OSM. Just to show you some extremes: A diver has completely different
opinions on importance than a plane-pilot. And a
hiker/foot-walker/horse-rider has a completely different opinion on this
compared to someone driving along a motorway.
> So it's perfectly
> reasonable to tag football stadiums
Well this is one of the first things I disabled when I got my new Navi System.
I really was not interested in all the Soccer stadiums and SportsBars here in
Germany. This is what I mean if I say the focus of different people is
sometimes orthogonally different. But what we need is a filtering mechanism,
so everyone only sees the things he is really interested in.
> and churches because by virtue
> of being easily recognizable they serve as a point of reference
> out there in the field.
> However, amenities="wifi", ="park_ride", ="clinic" etc don't share
> that purpose. There is little value to add them to a map.
I definitely and strongly disagree with your attitude here!
I convinced that things like a clinic, a hotel, a gas station, a supermarket
are more than valuable, even necessary on a map. For one point I need them to
find these thing for another they help me to navigate by matching them with
So I would strongly recommend to keep and add all those "Point Of Interest" to
our Database. This is one of the things which make a map complete and
valuable. And only if we have all this data in one place we're able to
say "WE are THE MAP-source". Otherwise programs like GpsDrive have to start
trying to find dozens of different sources to get a workable basemap. And
this is exactly what I don't want that everyone has to do over and over
> That is not to say there is no value in knowing where these things are.
I'm glad you're in conses with me at least on this part ;-)
> But that purpose is better served with a seperate project
> (let's call it openyellowpages). And certainly in Web 2.0 spirit
> of things there would be a mash-up so that if a user searches for
> all wifi zones in her neighbourhoud she'd get back a map from
> openstreetmap and an overlay from openyellowpages.
But the problem would be; every external programmer (like me being the
GpsDrive maintainer) has to start over again to collect the different sources
together to get all valuable data. This is work which will then be done over
and over again. Which definitely is a big waste of effort in the current
> So, I'll be voting against nearly all amenities proposals that are
> currently being considered and I hope to find some people who think
> the same about this.
As already stated I definitely want to see all these feature inside OUR
OSM-Database. So for now I'd definitely vote for putting all this information
into the central OSM-Database.
If for some reasons you want to create a map without any of this information
it is very simple to deactivate all the rendering rules you don't want to
show up. But it is way more difficult to collect all this Information from
other sources and then start creating rendering rules for all these tags.
Jörg (Germany, Munich)
TeamSpeak2: ts2.ostertag.name, user: tweety, Channel: "GPS Drive"
Tel.: +49 89 420950304
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