[OSM-talk] YOURS now supports route using only cycleroutes - Update

[Lambertus]

Gert, I see a message containing: 'just', 'should', 'would', 'just' and 
ending with 'then'... that made me chuckle ;)

No, to be serious, Gosmore has it's own binary database that represents 
a special 'view' on the supplied OSM data. It's all fairly high abstract 
low level bit juggling to me. Although I like fiddling with bits it 
needs some time to grasp what's going on and I admit I haven't taken the 
time to do that, so this is all a bit guesswork: The Gosmore database 
does not have a notion of relations and where it finally comes down to 
is to be able to lookup nearby objects very quickly in a large data set 
and collect penalties for every possible route following a Gosmore 
specific A* algorithm implementation.

So if I'm going to do magical things with Gosmore (things it wouldn't do 
normally) then this should be done by manipulating the OSM data before 
it enters the Gosmore db, as I said in my previous mail. I have no clue 
how much work it would be to create scripts that could implement all 
mine/yours wishes regarding cycle route planning data juggling. It would 
require intimate knowledge of the inner workings of Gosmore and because 
Gosmore is still in early development it could mean that scripts break 
all the time when new versions appear. Finally, when one would be 
intimate familiar with how Gosmore works then the necessary changes 
could also be made in Gosmore itself, which brings me back to the second 
paragraph: I don't have that knowledge and I don't plan to gain that 
knowledge soon because developing YOURS alone eats up all my spare time 
already.

It would be great to have more people with an interest in routing 
working on Gosmore then just Nic Roets alone, I believe this is also his 
wish.

Gert Gremmen wrote:
> Hi Lambertus,
>
> As I understand, YOURS routing is currently done on
> a database constructed from OSM. I do not know
> the structure of gosmore database, so I may be talking
> nonsense :
>
> I was questioning myself :
>
> What exactly is the problem in -on the fly- while constructing the
> router
> database-  projecting the relations (routes) onto the existing roads ,
> and adding suitable
> "tags" onto normal routable roads, be it bicycle, footway or normal
> roads...
> As a relation is just a collection of ways, this should be successful 
> for every relation.
> Then you would have a mixed mode database, routable by the standard
> gosmore
> that just need to into account the created tags.
> You might then :
>
> - route on cyclenetworks only = make the tag mandatory
> - route by preference on cycleroutes = add preference value to tagged
> roads from relation
> - route on busroutes (if you add and take into account the right tagging
> )
>
>
> Gert
>
> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> Van: talk-bounces at openstreetmap.org
> [mailto:talk-bounces at openstreetmap.org] Namens Lambertus
> Verzonden: Thursday, September 11, 2008 2:31 PM
> Aan: Shaun McDonald
> CC: talk at openstreetmap.org
> Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk] YOURS now supports route using only
> cycleroutes - Update
>
> Ok, so you want a have-it-all-cycle-route-planner which I would like to 
> have as well. But I don't see that happening with my current tools in a 
> short term unfortunately. That's why I said in my announcement mail: 
> 'now able to calculate routes using *only* cycle routes and networks'. 
> This means that you'll have to find your way to the nearest stretch of 
> cycle route the old fashioned way ;)
>
> I know that this new feature is not very useful for the real end-user 
> atm, I just hope the fact that it's existence will inspire only to map 
> even more cycle routes until the map has so many routes that every bit 
> is interconnected with any other bit. Then you could route using cycle 
> routes/networks from one end of the country to another. :D
>
>
> Shaun McDonald wrote:
>   
>> Lambertus wrote:
>>     
>>> Shaun McDonald wrote:
>>>       
>>>> This explains why I can't route from my house to work, where at each
>>>>         
>
>   
>>>> end there is no local cycle route, and there are several small bits 
>>>> in the middle where you cannot route over. This is either due to me 
>>>> not having bothered to split the way, or as you say, there is a 
>>>> break in the relation.
>>>>
>>>>         
>>> I don't understand this. You want to use cycle route/network routing 
>>> for a work/home route where both work and home are nowhere near a 
>>> cycle route or network? This seems pretty obvious to me actually... 
>>> Please use the Mapnik or Cycle layer to route using all available 
>>> roads where cyclists are allowed....
>>>
>>>       
>> About 7 out of the 9 mile trip is on lcn.
>>
>> When I do my random day cycles, I ask the question, how can I get to 
>> .... about 50 to 100 miles away, mostly using cycle network. I'll 
>> happily go on trunk roads, but it is nicer to be able to go on the 
>> more cycle friendly roads.
>>
>>     
>>>> It would be really cool if you could have an edit permalink so that 
>>>> you can edit the data on the openstreetmap web site.
>>>>         
>>> There is a button in the header that labels: 'Edit map'. If you click
>>>       
>
>   
>>> that then Potlatch is opened with the current map view.
>>>       
>> Doh
>>
>>     
>>>> Would it be possible for you to have a different marker for the 
>>>> start and end?
>>>>         
>>> Yes, it is possible, but not implemented yet :-)
>>>       
>> 8-)
>>     
>>>> Finally I was initially expecting a routing system that would prefer
>>>>         
>
>   
>>>> cycle routes, however this makes an excellent data 
>>>> validation/testing tool.
>>>>
>>>>         
>>> It already does prefer cycle routes, in fact is does *only* cycle 
>>> routes. But maybe that's your point.
>>>       
>> Exactly, I was expecting that it would be able to bridge between the 
>> parts of the cycle networks. However that will not allow people to be 
>> able to fix the data easily, when there is an unexpected break in the 
>> relation.
>>     
>>> If you want the best of both worlds then I think Gosmore has to be 
>>> adapted to accommodate this or the OSM data for the routing database 
>>> should be manipulated in such a way that Gosmore gives a high penalty
>>>       
>
>   
>>> to non-cycle route ways.
>>>       
>> That sounds more like what I was expecting.
>>
>> Shaun
>>
>>     
>
>
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