[Imports] Import of forests, farmland and other types of land cover for Sweden generated from Naturvårdsverkets Nationella Marktäckedata 2018

[Nate Wessel]

I tend to agree with Frederik on this.

I'm not quite sure why there's a feeling that all places need to be 
mapped at some minimum level of detail. Just because one area has e.g. 
landuses that doesn't mean all the countryside needs them too for 
consistency. I see this inconsistency of detail/completeness as one of 
the strengths of OSM actually. Places that are missing data now would 
presumably have less accurate data if there were an import that didn't 
involve extensive engagement from local mappers. When the data is not 
there at least you can see what's missing and replace it in your 
personal projects with data from other sources.

Importing huge amounts of data just produces stale data if we do little 
in the meantime to cultivate engaged mappers. And in that regard, I 
think we lead by example to a large degree. If we show new members of 
this OSM community that big things get done through (sometimes 
contentious) imports, then that is how new contributors are likely to 
engage with the project. If we instead demonstrate that a lot can be 
accomplished by individuals mapping the areas they know personally, then 
perhaps that is the outcome we will see more of.

Cheers,

Nate Wessel
Jack of all trades, Master of Geography, PhD candidate in Urban Planning
NateWessel.com <http://natewessel.com>

On 4/30/19 3:28 AM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> Hi,
>
> On 30.04.19 02:02, Jarek Piórkowski wrote:
>> Are we to conclude that
>> since a part has been mapped, all parts would have been eventually
>> mapped?
> All places of interest to enough people would eventually be mapped.
>
>> I'll give an example: Toronto, a metro region of about 5 million
>> people, did not have the vast majority of its buildings mapped until
>> an import started in late 2018.
> I think buildings are overrated. If the local mappers prefer to
> concentrate on other things, that's not a problem.
>
> And yes, not all areas on the planet currently have enough mappers to
> map the place well. But we're not a business project where we need to
> deliver results by Q3 or else our shareholders will complain. We can
> give the community time to grow, and decide what they want to do with
> their time, and how important it is to them to have a map, and what they
> want to have on the map.
>
> And yes, there might be regions that will never have a good OSM map
> because the locals don't care or can't afford the time to make it. Does
> that mean someone else should step in and do it for them? I think not.
>
>> every hour sketching buildings
>> from imagery where they could be imported is an hour editors aren't
>> out in the real world surveying or recruiting new mappers.
> For me, sketching buildings doesn't usually collide with surveying
> because I do the former when it's dark outside ;)
>
> If you say there are local mappers in a place and they are willing to
> take ownership of an imported building data set, removing buildings that
> get torn down and adding buildings that get built, and so on, then I'm
> much more inclined to welcome a building import than if someone says
> "there's nobody mapping this here anyway so might as well import".
>
>> But okay, so we just don't map every single-family building in OSM.
> This is not a decision that needs to be the same across OSM. In some
> cities mappers might run out of stuff to map and start to map lamp posts
> and trees because they're done with buildings; in others, they might not
> even start the buildings.
>
>> Then another example: I have just now sketched in the first forest
>> polygons in a part of a UNESCO World Biosphere Reserve. Somehow no
>> craft mapper had done it yet, but maybe they would have in another
>> decade?
> Sure, it takes time to do it well, and if it's not in OSM then you can
> mix in a shape file from the UNESCO or whatnot if you need it on your map.
>
>> For that matter, there are parts of London Zone 2 which are missing
>> shops and multi-unit buildings.
> Maybe none of the locals was interested enough to add them. We shouldn't
> judge them on that.
>
>> But I suppose we have a process to
>> cooperatively assemble local knowledge of human mappers that will
>> allow them to be mapped, someday, maybe.
> Exactly. And if it takes another decade for the local community to take
> ownership and do it, then that's what it takes. Sure I could fly there
> and add all the shops quickly, but what then, am I going to fly there
> every month from now on to update?
>
> Bye
> Frederik
>
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