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peter chao freecycle.sub at gmail.com
Fri May 29 11:23:54 UTC 2015


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: moltonel 3x Combo <moltonel at gmail.com>
Date: Fri, May 29, 2015 at 7:14 AM
Subject: Re: [OSM-talk] Can wikidata links help fight name inflation?
To: SomeoneElse <lists at atownsend.org.uk>
Cc: talk at openstreetmap.org


On 29/05/2015, SomeoneElse <lists at atownsend.org.uk> wrote:
> how do we distinguish in the Abergavenny case between the two
> established names and the "up to 7,000" (but realistically in the short
> term a few hundred) translations?  That's unfortunately something that
> name:xx in OSM doesn't give us currently

You don't distinguish them, and that's fine. There may be many many
more pleople using "Abergavenny" than "Абергавенни", but that doesn't
mean that the name isn't established, at its more limited scale.

Speaking of plain dumb transliterations that got established, have a
read of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Place_names_in_Ireland . Despite
sharing the latin alphabet, all Irish placenames have been
systematically "translated" when Ireland was under British rule. The
transliteration job has been ridiculed by the locals and is no better
than what a modern algorythm would do, but for better or worse today I
live in "Kilkenny" more than I live in "Cill Cainnigh".

> A question to those suggesting "Абергавенни" as a name:ru for
> Abergavenny / Y Fenni - how to distinguish the latter (both are names
> that you can to compare with signposts to see that you're going in the
> right direction) with the former (which you can't, but a speaker of that
> language might use to refer to that place in their own language)?

Where the signpost toward "Pékin" (the french name for Beijing) ?
Where on UK soil can I find the city sign for "Londres" ? Foreign
names for local places *are* harder to verify, and we rightfully cast
a more critical eye on them. But we've got plenty of hard-to-verify
data in OSM, and we rarely take a deletionist approach to it. And for
better or worse, Russia-based contributors are better suited to know
what should go into name:ru than UK-based contributors. And as it
happens, Абергавенни comes from Abergavenny rather than Y Fenni,
showing that some discernment was applied.

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