[Tagging] Tagging established, unofficial and wild campings

David Bannon dbannon at internode.on.net
Sun Mar 22 22:58:33 UTC 2015

On Sun, 2015-03-22 at 11:19 +0000, Jan van Bekkum wrote:
> If I would have to choose between the options I would go for
> full_service, but I leave this to the native speakers. If I get the
> same service and pay the same for a state run campground as for a
> privately run one it can be called commercial.
Yes, its a problem Jan.  I think most taggers standing in a camp ground
trying to think of a name would come up with 'commercial' first. Then,
maybe "full service", "serviced" ?? A poor second/third IMHO.

I'm looking at Ayres Rock and Kathrine Gorge, two examples of full
facility parks run by National Parks people. The brochure from Kathrine
Gorge says "fully serviced". Interesting, the campground at Ayres Rock
is in fact commercial, must be leased out !

Dave S, knowing the American thoughts on such things, are you sure the
camp grounds you are talking about are really run by National Parks ?
Or 'operated' by a commercial entity under contract ?

I think it would be a mistake to make another category of camp ground
that apparently covers the same user experience but just has a different
business structure behind it. But if the name sounds wrong, its wrong !


> Is it a problem if tourism=camp_site wouldn't get the attribute
> camp_site=commercial in this case? It is the default and most common
> one anyhow.
> On Sun, Mar 22, 2015 at 11:03 AM Dave Swarthout
> <daveswarthout at gmail.com> wrote:
>         I was trying to do as Richard suggested, that is, trim the
>         other replies off the message. Screwed that up.
>         It's not the definition I object to, it's the use of the term
>         commercial. Regardless of the quacking like a duck comparison,
>         the national, state, and forest service campgrounds are simply
>         not commercial by American standards. That's why I was trying
>         to redefine designated to make it possible to include our
>         state and national park camp_sites in that category, or any
>         category. I can practically guarantee that nobody in the
>         United States will tag a camp_site inside of a national park
>         as commercial. If I'm left with the definitions the way they
>         are now, I'll simply tag them as tourism=camp_site and be done
>         with it. Other amenities can be added to nodes or buildings as
>         appropriate.
>         Let's come up with a better term for the full-featured
>         ("flash") sites we're talking about. This recent modification
>         is good but still needs work, IMO
>              1. Commercial campgrounds: large sites for tents,
>                 caravans and RV's, offering toilets, showers,
>                 internet, laundry and dish washing facilities, a shop,
>                 a swimming pool, waste stations, internet, etc. They
>                 are often crowded, usually have defined pitches and
>                 someone is in charge. Commercial campgrounds are found
>                 in countries with a camping holiday culture like North
>                 America, Western Europe, South Africa and Australia.
>                 They can be run by private parties, but also by public
>                 bodies on a commercial basis like the campgrounds in
>                 South African National Parks;
>         How about full_service, full_featured, comprehensive? I don't
>         like any of these and only offer them as food for thought. But
>         I cannot get on board with commercial.
>         On Sun, Mar 22, 2015 at 4:37 PM, David Bannon
>         <dbannon at internode.on.net> wrote:
>                 Dave S, think you missed the list....
>                 On Sun, 2015-03-22 at 09:19 +0700, Dave Swarthout
>                 wrote:
>                 > Okay then, Your idea is to define the campgrounds
>                 inside of national
>                 > and state parks as commercial ones?
>                 Well, its more a case of are you paying to camp
>                 there ?  And are you
>                 being provided with extensive services or not ?
>                 Here in Aus, camp grounds in national parks are
>                 generally more basic,
>                 they are cheap, minimal facilities. But some, at
>                 specific places, are
>                 more like commercial ones. So, I'd call the flash ones
>                 commercial, even
>                 though they are operated by Parks.
>                 >
>                 >
>                 > I have no problem with that other than I usually
>                 don't consider
>                 > government run operations of any type, including
>                 campgrounds, as
>                 > "commercial".
>                 If it quacks like a duck, walks like a duck, I reckon
>                 its a duck !
>                 > Commercial implies a business run for profit, not a
>                 governmental
>                 > administered operation. All I'm looking for is a
>                 category into which
>                 > the majority of the campgrounds in the United States
>                 will fit. If you
>                 > want to lump them together then the definition of
>                 commercial needs to
>                 > change.
>                 Yes, maybe its a case that the name is wrong. Not sure
>                 of a better name.
>                 When you think about it, the camp ground it self (in
>                 those flash
>                 National Parks) are in fact run for profit, the profit
>                 goes back to help
>                 running the park, but its still run on a fee for
>                 service basis.
>                 David
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>         -- 
>         Dave Swarthout
>         Homer, Alaska
>         Chiang Mai, Thailand
>         Travel Blog at http://dswarthout.blogspot.com
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