[Tagging] Access by permit

[Dave Swarthout]

@warin wrote,

>NO. The formal process is"
...
...

>*OR*
>You can simply use the tag. There are some 235 uses from taginfo now, so
it has been used.
>As there are few of these tags around then it should be documented  -
create a new wiki page.
>235 is not large but it does establish a use.

That's almost exactly what I said. Anyone who wants to can use the tag,
REGARDLESS of whether it is "approved" by the members of this or any other
list. Hence my conclusion that the result of the voting is non-binding. The
voting process might be used to improve the tag or, in cases where it's
obviously wrong, discarded but our approval is not, strictly speaking,
essential.

We always strive for consensus but it cannot always be had. So...

On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 1:01 PM, José G Moya Y. <josemoya at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi
> I agree with the permit system as it is discused here. I found it useful
> for National Parks, specially for World Heritage Biosphere Reservations,
>  where a small amount of people has to book in advance.
> If it keeps getting a strong opposition, you could consider mapping as
> access=fee and adding a "book" tag somewhere in the fee system, such as
> fee=book, to make users know the access needs booking in advance.
> But I prefer access=permit.
>
> El 21/9/2017 4:48, "Warin" <61sundowner at gmail.com> escribió:
>
>> On 21-Sep-17 11:24 AM, Dave Swarthout wrote:
>>
>> I am in total agreement with the proposal as it's been developed in this
>> thread.
>>
>> I too am unfamiliar with structuring the voting process but it may be
>> enough to simply add a new section "Voting" at the end of the page, copying
>> some boiler-plate from some other proposal, and advertising on this list.
>> The voting, just like any discussion we engage in on these mailing lists,
>> is open to debate and the result is AFAIK non-binding. People can do as
>> they wish afterward.
>>
>> NO. The formal process is to;
>> 1) create a proposal page -
>> 2) then call for comments as a new subject here on this list.
>> 3) After at least 2 weeks consider any comments made, modify the proposal
>> and if that looks good
>> 4) then call for votes as a new subject here on this list.
>> 5) after another 2 weeks and some number of votes consider if it passes
>>
>> OR
>> You can simply use the tag. There are some 235 uses from taginfo now, so
>> it has been used.
>> As there are few of these tags around then it should be documented  -
>> create a new wiki page.
>> 235 is not large but it does establish a use.
>>
>> Taginfo also has use of 'permit' .. no explanation of what these are for
>> and the numbers are small.
>>
>> Comment - there are a few that use it for car parks in the US. But no
>> information on where to obtain a permit.
>> I do think that the permit contact details need to be available, and this
>> should be suggested a a 'recommendation'? on the wiki page.
>>
>>
>> Many thanks to Kevin for the work you've done on this tag.
>>
>> On Thu, Sep 21, 2017 at 5:39 AM, Warin <61sundowner at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On 21-Sep-17 06:01 AM, marc marc wrote:
>>>
>>>> Le 20. 09. 17 à 20:39, Kevin Kenny a écrit :
>>>>
>>>>> Is this a minimal proposal that we can all tolerate?
>>>>>
>>>> I do not see any difference between access=permit and (not tag for)
>>>> access to a sports club : you can go there if you meet certain
>>>> conditions and generally any sports club allows you to "buy a permit
>>>> according to their formality"
>>>> I see no difference with private property either. if you "follow"
>>>> my formalities, you will have the right to come at home.
>>>> I think that it would be preferable to improve access=private
>>>> by adding a tag to describe any means of "overriding" this restriction
>>>> rather than inventing a new type of access that is between sports clubs
>>>> are public for the moment), access=private and paying infrastructure
>>>> like tool roads.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The primary difference between access=private and access=permit
>>> is that a formal permit system exists that anyone can easily use.
>>> Some permits are easy and free,
>>> some you and I cannot get (unless you are the right tribe or have strong
>>> cultural connections).
>>>
>>> Examples;
>>> The Kokoda Trail is not 'owned' by the permit authority.
>>> Here the Trail goes through many villages and is administered by a
>>> government appointed body.
>>> The practice here is to get a permit from the authority and not bother
>>> with the property owners.
>>> Typically normal people will use a guided 'tour' and that organisation
>>> will be registered with the authority and get the individual permits.
>>>
>>> The Woomera Prohibited Areas (e.g. way 436098551) again are not 'owned'
>>> by the authority.
>>> These areas have both the rocket range and property owners.
>>> The range operators have provided the property owners with shelters -
>>>  most of the property owners use the shelters as cool places to shelter
>>> from the heat (as well as rockets).
>>> Here I would hope that people wanting access would negotiate with both
>>> the permit system and the private property owner.
>>> The permit system ensures that travellers are not present when the
>>> rockets are being fired.
>>>
>>> ------------------------
>>> There is enough difference that it should be tagged together with the
>>> way that permits can be obtained.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Dave Swarthout
>> Homer, Alaska
>> Chiang Mai, Thailand
>> Travel Blog at http://dswarthout.blogspot.com
>>
>>
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-- 
Dave Swarthout
Homer, Alaska
Chiang Mai, Thailand
Travel Blog at http://dswarthout.blogspot.com
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