[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Walkingbus_stop

Selfish Seahorse selfishseahorse at gmail.com
Sun May 6 09:16:52 UTC 2018


I don't mean that they shouldn't be mapped but that I'd rather not use
the public transport scheme for it.

On 6 May 2018 at 10:53, Erkin Alp Güney <erkinalp9035 at gmail.com> wrote:
> What about foot tram routes? Should they be mapped?
>
>
> 06-05-2018 11:51 tarihinde Selfish Seahorse yazdı:
>> Hi,
>>
>> Like Martin, I think the public transport scheme should not be used
>> here, because a walking bus is neither a form of transport nor is it
>> really public.
>>
>>
>> On 6 May 2018 at 09:45, Lorenzo Stucchi <lorenzo.stucchi at mail.polimi.it> wrote:
>>> Hi,
>>> I’m sorry for the error that I made using the old Public Transport scheme,
>>> so according to what was proposed before I correct the page proposing the
>>> tag: walikingbus=yes to be used with public_transport=platform like was now
>>> proposed in the page
>>>
>>> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Walkingbus_stop
>>>
>>> Thanks and sorry again for my mistake
>>> Hi,
>>> LorenzoStucchi
>>>
>>> Date: Sun, 6 May 2018 12:28:09 +1000
>>> From: <osm.tagging at thorsten.engler.id.au>
>>> To: "'Tag discussion, strategy and related tools'"
>>> <tagging at openstreetmap.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Walkingbus_stop
>>> Message-ID: <00ab01d3e4e1$e1575d50$a40617f0$@thorsten.engler.id.au>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>>>
>>> Well, but based on your description, these are not planned routes in any
>>> way. They are purely transient emergent behaviour based on the fact that a
>>> lot of people want to move between these two points, and this is the obvious
>>> way to go.
>>>
>>> Take the people away, and the phenomenon disappears. This is not something
>>> that does not exist on its own.
>>>
>>> A bus route, a foot or hiking route, or a walking bus route on the other
>>> hand all exist even in the absence of people There are stops with signs,
>>> guiding signs, brochures showing the route... The route is planned and
>>> documented, and (at least till someone changes the planning) operate and
>>> exist even in the absence of people using them.
>>>
>>> The only thing that exist of what you describe is the environment that
>>> promotes this particular emergent behaviour, like the pedestrian zone sign,
>>> and these can and should obviously be mapped.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Erkin Alp Güney <erkinalp9035 at gmail.com>
>>> Sent: Sunday, 6 May 2018 00:59
>>> To: tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Walkingbus_stop
>>>
>>> Not really transient and some routes can be over 500m in length. For
>>> example, in Karşıyaka, more than 100 people/min/sq-m walks following
>>> Bahriye Üçok Boulevard (western sidewalk only) and Kemalpaşa Avenue
>>> (pedestrianised during the day and evening, pedestrian priority
>>> otherwise, marked by a pedestrian zone sign) between Karşıyaka
>>> Underground Car Parking and "Hergele Meydanı" (all comers' square).
>>>
>>>
>>> 05-05-2018 17:51 tarihinde osm.tagging at thorsten.engler.id.au yazdı:
>>>
>>> If they are unmarked on the ground, are they documented somewhere?
>>>
>>> Or is it simply a case of "this is a common route a lot of people
>>>
>>> walk
>>>
>>> during certain times as there is a strong flow of people from A to
>>>
>>> B
>>>
>>> and this is the most commonly used route"? (In which case they
>>>
>>> aren't
>>>
>>> really something that exists as an entity of it's own and are only
>>>
>>> a
>>>
>>> transient event, though maybe a commonly reoccurring one.)
>>>
>>> In either case, it doesn't sound like a "walking bus" at all.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Erkin Alp Güney <erkinalp9035 at gmail.com>
>>> Sent: Sunday, 6 May 2018 00:09
>>> To: tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Walkingbus_stop
>>>
>>> No, foot tram routes are unmarked but you can easily join one by
>>> following the crowd. Normal foot routes have guiding signs.
>>>
>>>
>>> 05-05-2018 17:05 tarihinde osm.tagging at thorsten.engler.id.au
>>>
>>> yazdı:
>>>
>>> Without a "driver", fixed "stops" and a defined schedule, that
>>>
>>> sounds more like what's currently already mapped using
>>>
>>> route=foot
>>>
>>> relations?
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Erkin Alp Güney <erkinalp9035 at gmail.com>
>>> Sent: Saturday, 5 May 2018 23:28
>>> To: tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Walkingbus_stop
>>>
>>> We also have walking bus routes in Turkey but without drivers.
>>>
>>> We
>>>
>>> call them "tabanvay", foot tram. You can have very crowded
>>>
>>> walking
>>>
>>> bus routes in peak times, especially in pedestrian road
>>>
>>> networks.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 05-05-2018 15:59 tarihinde osm.tagging at thorsten.engler.id.au
>>>
>>> yazdı:
>>>
>>> If there are actual poles and stop signs, you can only “board”
>>>
>>> at
>>>
>>> these places and at specific times, and the “driver” stays
>>>
>>> with
>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>> group from the first to the last stop, then yeah, I can see
>>>
>>> this
>>>
>>> as
>>>
>>> being very different from a “school crossing guard” which
>>>
>>> generally
>>>
>>> stays at one specific crossing and controls the traffic there.
>>>
>>> And
>>>
>>> under these conditions, I think the term “platform” as it is
>>>
>>> used
>>>
>>> in
>>>
>>> PTv2 does apply to the position of the poles.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:*Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>
>>> *Sent:* Saturday, 5 May 2018 22:42
>>> *To:* Tag discussion, strategy and related tools
>>> <tagging at openstreetmap.org>
>>> *Subject:* Re: [Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC -
>>>
>>> Walkingbus_stop
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> sent from a phone
>>>
>>>
>>> On 4. May 2018, at 22:34, Johnparis <okosm at johnfreed.com
>>> <mailto:okosm at johnfreed.com>> wrote:
>>>
>>>    Please DO follow Thorsten's suggestion and follow PTv2,
>>>
>>> mapping
>>>
>>>    the stops as nodes alongside the street/way (not on it) in
>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>>    proper direction. Tag each one:
>>>
>>>    walking_bus=yes
>>>
>>>    public_transport=platform
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> is walking really a kind of “public transport”? Are we going
>>>
>>> to
>>>
>>> tag
>>>
>>> places as public transport platforms where people are waiting
>>>
>>> for
>>>
>>> someone else to accompany them for walking somewhere?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> To me “walking bus” seems just a new buzzword for a service
>>>
>>> that
>>>
>>> has
>>>
>>> been in existence for a long time (school crossing guards) and
>>>
>>> that
>>>
>>> was never considered public transport until someone proclaimed
>>>
>>> it
>>>
>>> could be seen as kind of “bus” but without a vehicle ;-)
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I don’t think it shouldn’t be tagged, but I don’t see it as
>>>
>>> public
>>>
>>> transport either, particularly I don’t believe we should use
>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>> term
>>>
>>> platform in context of this kind of service
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> cheers,
>>>
>>> Martin
>>>
>>>
>>>
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