[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - (consulate)

Allan Mustard allan at mustard.net
Wed Oct 31 07:58:22 UTC 2018

Sounds like you just volunteered to do a session on tagging at the next SOTM and to help me write the wiki articles supporting whatever we end up voting on :-)

I hear you on tagging but don’t agree that a current inadequacy of tagging is a reason to torpedo improvement to accuracy and clarity.

The vast majority of users will not care if it is a consulate or consulate general. They will want the location so they know where to go to apply for a visa or a passport. Let’s not be hypnotized by the complexity—simple top-level choices for simple mappers that can be expanded with additional tags by more experienced mappers.  It will make rendering easier snd the database more accurate.  That is my objective here.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Oct 31, 2018, at 9:45 AM, Warin <61sundowner at gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 31/10/18 12:33, Allan Mustard wrote:
>> Some responses to Warin:
>>> On 10/31/2018 3:45 AM, Warin wrote:
>>> Errr.
>>> By combining Embassy with High Commission there is a decrease in information.
>> No information is lost.  "High Commission" is an embassy by another name, between Commonwealth members.  The term "high commission" would be preserved both in the embassy=* tag and the name=* tag.
> Mappers don't do sub tags well
> Example;
> Over 11,000 amenity=embassy
> Some 4,000 diplomatic=* 
> Less than half the 'embassies' have the tag diplomatic, yet over 95% have a name tag. 
> So they will use the name tag (that renders) together with the 
> amenity=embassy tag (that renders) but they are reluctant to use the diplomatic tag (that does not render).
> I think the same will occur to these embassy=* tags.
> Another decrease in information is consulate and consult general ... there may be more if I dig. 
>>> The VCDR does not mention embassy. It has 'mission' and 'consular' but no 'embassy', nor 'high commission' etc.
>> As I pointed out in an earlier post, "embassy" technically and legally consists of the people dispatched to a foreign country on a diplomatic mission.  By convention and in vernacular use, "embassy" is used to denote the physical structure of the diplomatic mission in which said people operate.  The VCDR is a legal document (a treaty).  It uses legal language.  I have provided a great deal of detail (much of which would be captured in the wiki, ultimately) describing the various flavors of diplomatic missions, which broadly speaking fall into three categories: embassies, consulates, and other.  If you doubt my word, as you seem to, please consult with your local ministry of foreign affairs.  If you are willing to take the word of Wikipedia, its article on diplomatic missions is pretty good: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diplomatic_mission#Naming
>>>> Then the real fun begins.  As I have read through the various comments and suggestions, it has occurred to me that the following hierarchy of tags would potentially fill the bill:
>>>> The three values/categories (embassy, consulate, other) would have specific subcategories.  If you wanted to do a key search in overpass turbo, it would still be possible. The subcategories would be 
>>>> * embassy=[embassy/yes, nunciature, high_commission, interests_section, mission, delegation, branch_embassy]
>>>> * consulate=[consulate/yes, consulate_general, consular_agency, consular_office, honorary_con
>>> The above 'consolidations' ... loose information.
>> How do they lose information?  All information is preserved in the additional tags.
> Those additional tags probably won't be used, see above. 
>>> If required that consolidation can be done in rendering. 
>>> But, I think, most renders now ignore them and simply render all of them the same. And, I think, that will continue for quite some time. 
>>> If a render chose to distinguish between them then they can do so, they cannot distinguish between an embassy and a high commission if that information is not there.
>> I cannot conceive of a circumstance under which anyone would want to render embassies and high commissions differently.  They are different names for the same level of diplomatic mission (a mission covered by the VCDR and headed by an ambassador).  If a renderer wanted to distinguish them, it could be done with an IF statement testing the existence of the string "high_commission" in either the name=* tag or the embassy=* tag.  Same goes for an overpass turbo search.
> If there no difference then they would be the same name. 
> Could be construed as the same kind of thing as the tag 'minor_mission'.  :) 
> Embassies and consulate are now rendered the same, that will probably continue, even if they have different tags. 
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