[Tagging] Is crop=yes tag completely and utterly useless?

Warin 61sundowner at gmail.com
Sun Aug 18 07:54:47 UTC 2019

On 18/08/19 16:39, Joseph Eisenberg wrote:
> "Crop is a produce"
> What does that mean?
> The word "crop" in British English means " a cultivated plant that is
> grown on a large scale commercially, especially a cereal, fruit, or
> vegetable. (Oxford); or "a plant such as a grain, fruit, or vegetable
> grown in large amounts" (Cambridge).
> Plants are not produce, "produce" is the thing that a plant produces,
> in OSM: "Describes a feature's agricultural output..." - so the word
> "crop" is not appropriate, because "crop" is not the agricultural
> output of an area of farmland, but a category.

'Crop' Look at the values used for crop crop=coconut, crop=wheat, 
crop=hay etc. All of the reasonable ones are also 'produce'. 
  (Unreasonable ones such as 'market gardening are not crops so fail as 
produce too.) Look at the OSM description: Crop: "The crop produced by 
cultivated land." That would not be the plant but the output? And it 
does not match the BE definition? 'Produce'  Englishdictionary as nounis 
defined by the Oxford English Dictionary as "Agricultural and other 
natural products collectively." In OSM description: Describes a 
feature's agricultural output produced though a natural process of 
growing or breeding. The BE and OSM meanings are a much closer match for 
'produce' where as they differ for 'crop'.

> But I see that there is some desire for a tag for generic cropland, or
> farmland used to grow unspecified crops. For this I would suggest the
> key "farmland=cropland" or "crop=field_cropland", rather than crop=yes
> (less specific) or produce=crop (unclear).
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/farmland
> https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/crop=field_cropland
> Warin, if you do decide to use any of these tags, please document them
> at a Tag: page or in your userspace or a proposal, if you have the
> time.

There are many values for the key crop that lack documentation. crop=field_cropland being one, I think that describes the landuse not the output.

Another one that looks to me to be very bad is 'market_gardening'.

As these are 'common' yet lack documentation there is a need for them to be documented by those that support them. Joseph?

> Joseph
> On 8/18/19, Warin <61sundowner at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Cannot farm land can be used for crops for some time, and then milk
>> cattle for some other period of time?
>> IIRC that is what one of my relatives did.

? Anyone care to comment?

>> On 18/08/19 11:20, Leif Rasmussen wrote:
>>> But isn't that the definition of farmland in OSM? I would map meadows,
>>> farmyards, and orchards with their respective tags, not with
>>> landuse=farmland.
>>> Leif R
>>> On Sat, Aug 17, 2019 at 7:18 PM Joseph Eisenberg
>>> <joseph.eisenberg at gmail.com <mailto:joseph.eisenberg at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>      Produce=crop would be worse, because “crop” is not a type of
>>>      produce, and produce= is only very rarely used for crop land (
>>>      crop= is the established key for types of crops like rice,
>>>      sugarcane, wheat, etc)
>> The rate of present usage does not limit the use of a tag.
>> colour=#93006B <https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/colour=%2393006B>
>> is only used once in the data base ..
>> height=16 metres is only used once in the data base...
>> Crop is a produce.
>> produce=crop has 2 uses .. presently.
>> I have been mapping a small area where my family farmed for several
>> generations ... tomorrow there will be a lot more produce=crop.
>> If the judgement is simply on frequency of use the result may well be
>> wrong.
>>>      As I mentioned on the Talk:Key:crop page, I suspect that this tag
>>>      crop=yes is sometimes used to say “this area of farmland is used
>>>      as crop land”, that is, to grow row crops like
>>>      grains/sugarcane/other annuals. So at least we know it probably
>>>      isn’t a meadow or a farmyard or an orchard?
>> Vineyards have their own tag, should the tag crop=grapes be removed?
>>>      Joseph
>>>      On Sun, Aug 18, 2019 at 7:44 AM Warin <61sundowner at gmail.com
>>>      <mailto:61sundowner at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>>          Would produce=crop be better?
>>>          As produce could be fish, cattle, sheep, wool, or crops.
>>>          produce=crop would say that only crops are produced here.
>>>          On 18/08/19 01:27, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
>>>          >
>>>          > sent from a phone
>>>          >
>>>          >> On 17. Aug 2019, at 17:09, Mateusz Konieczny
>>>          <matkoniecz at tutanota.com <mailto:matkoniecz at tutanota.com>> wrote:
>>>          >>
>>>          >> 9326 of 9657 crop=yes is on landuse=farmland - it seems to
>>>          me that it is
>>>          >> not adding any information whatsoever.
>>>          >
>>>          > certainly removing them would be even less useful? You could
>>>          read it as a way of stating that something is purposefully
>>>          grown there. Someone else might refine it later ...
>>>          >
>>>          > Cheers Martin
>>>          > ______________

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