[Tagging] Superroutes - good, bad or ugly?

Paul Allen pla16021 at gmail.com
Thu Mar 14 17:39:52 UTC 2019

On Thu, 14 Mar 2019 at 16:44, Martin Koppenhoefer <dieterdreist at gmail.com>

> > On 14. Mar 2019, at 16:49, Tony Shield <tony.shield999 at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > Can they currently be edited with JOSM?
> of course, you simply add a relation as member to another relation.

Can you?  It's not clear to me from the documentation that I can do that in
a way that achieves what
I want to do and is compatible with accepted usage.  If you can tell me how
to do that I'll be very

Let me be clear.  I want to decompose a route into segments and then
construct some sort of
relation (ordinary, superroute or whatever) that assembles them in
sequence.  I want to do this
because I have a route which traverses some ways twice.  I want to do this
because the same route
has ways which are traversed twice (A, B, C, D) but the first time the stop
at C is ignored (you can
neither board nor alight there) and the second time the stop at C is usable
(you can board or alight).
I want to do this because although the route is circular, it is "hairy" (in
the mathematical sense), it's
not an "O" but an "O=".  The same way is traversed twice in opposite
directions: in a non-circular
route that would be two variants of a route master but this is a circular

Being able to decompose the route solves several problems.  As a single
route it is a real pain
to edit because the tools don't fully support the same way appearing twice
(maybe there's a JOSM
plugin that does it better).  I still have a gap on the route according to
JOSM validator but I
can't spot it.  It doesn't show as a red dot in the edit relation table, I
can't see it by scrolling through
the list of ways and looking at them, when I go to the validator and try
zooming to the problem
nothing happens.  It's in one of the ways that gets traversed twice and
it's driving me crazy.  I think
that subroutes would make it a lot easier for me to zero in on the problem.

As a single route it's impossible to figure out by simple inspection of the
query tool:
You tell me where it goes in what sequence without delving deeply into the
relation.  I'll give
you a hint: it starts and ends here:
Want another hint?  It doesn't just start and end there, it also stops
there in the middle of its
route.  Without looking at the details of the relation, tell me where it
goes next after that
starting point.  Being able to decompose it into segments would allow
people to see a
sequence of segments in order (such as via umap) and it would be obvious
what the route
is.  Having segments would allow me to deal with the stop that is passed
twice (in the same
direction) but is only used once - it would appear on one segment but not
the other.

So I don't care if it's a superroute, a master relation (I'm not keen on
that because this route
has several variants so I'd end up with a master relation of variants that
are themselves master
relations of segments), or something else.  I'd just like to be able to do

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