[Tagging] ref on roundabout

Mateusz Konieczny matkoniecz at tutanota.com
Sun Aug 23 16:33:24 UTC 2020

Aug 23, 2020, 15:23 by f at zz.de:

> On Sat, Aug 22, 2020 at 01:28:07PM +0200, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging wrote:
>> Aug 22, 2020, 12:17 by f at zz.de:
>> > On Sat, Aug 22, 2020 at 12:09:14PM +0200, Mateusz Konieczny via Tagging wrote:
>> >
>> >> I would expect roundabout to be split in parts where
>> >> ref is applying and parts where it is not applying, in other words
>> >> without any special handling and tag it as usual.
>> >>
>> >
>> > But the point is that on a roundabout the "name" references the name
>> > of the _roundabout_ not one of the streets connected to it. 
>> >
>> Yes
>> > Same should apply to ref as it will reference the Roundabout
>> why?
> 1. How do you tag a reference number for a roundabout when suddenly
> the ref contains a ref of one of the streets?
Can you give example of roundabout with its reference number?

For now it feels like a theorethical excercise.

I never considered such case as I have never encountered or
heard about junction with its ref.

But there are named junctions, and I would look there for inspiration.

> 2. Inconsistency - Some informations on the roundabout contain
> informations about itself, and some are just copied over from 
> attached streets.
>> So it is about case where road has its own reference number
>> and junction has its own reference number, separate from
>> reference number of road routes?
> Yes - We should be consistent that an object carries informations about
> itself and ONLY itself and not carry on some information of related
> objects. To glue objects together or describe their relation 
> we typically use relations. We do this in Germany a lot - So primary
> roads typically have relations carrying all road segments including
> the roundabout. 
>> In Poland road route continues through roaundabout and roaundabout way
>> is part of such route.
> Correct - In Germany - at least for "StraรŸen NRW" thats the same. The
> road surface of the roundabout is part of the Road through it. But
> nevertheless - OSM has had a different Data Model to address/reference
> roundabouts itself to be able to do landmark routing e.g
> "Take 1st exit at the Hampstead Roundabout, then take the 2nd exit at
> the Foobar Roundabout".
> For this to work you have to put the information about the roundabout
> itself somewhere. This has been documented for ages to be the
> way carrying the junction=roundabout which has a name tag on its own.
> So using ref on the roundabout for either the road, or a reference
> of the roundabout breaks the assumptions that informations on the
> junction=roundabout only refer to the roundabout. With this concept
> it may sometimes refer to one or more roads which are connected to the
> roundabout. This basically makes the information useless.
> Flo
> -- 
> Florian Lohoff                                                 f at zz.de
>  UTF-8 Test: The ๐Ÿˆ ran after a ๐Ÿ, but the ๐Ÿ ran away

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