[Tagging] tagging historic ruins
rob at senecass.com
Sun Jan 5 19:21:35 UTC 2020
On 1/5/20 11:55 AM, Tod Fitch wrote:
> The name value almost certainly should not be “Indian Ruin”. If
> “Indian Ruin” is used for a value at all it should be in the
> description tag. Probably the more politically correct nowadays
> might be “Native American ruins”.
That was my thought, "Indian Ruin" is overly generic, and should just
be deleted as file bloat.
> Most of the larger sites have official names. “Montezuma Castle
> National Monument”, “Casa Grande Ruins National Monument”, “Tuzigoot
> National Monument”, “Tonto National Monument”, “Walnut Canyon
> National Monument”, “Palatki Heritage Site” and “Canyon de Chelly
> National Monument” in Arizona spring to mind. Within those sites the
> there may be individual buildings/groups of buildings that have
> names as well but those often seem to be descriptive (“Big House” or
> “South Buildings”).
Correct, but that's when 'name=' should be used. And the name may also
be subject to interpretation based on who you ask. Many official names
have little to do with what the locals call it. OSM can support both.
> peoples (different native American tribes moving in, Spanish or
> Anglo). So I think the official names, probably found in the GNIS
> database is the best you are going to do.
Yep, it's now the Ute reservation. I'm not going to add any names at
this point, just curious about cleaning up some existing data. Mapping
the ruins isn't the purpose of this trip, I just was wondering when
looking at the data, and had the motivation to be a data janitor since I
probably will try to ski/hike to some of these ruins.
> Regarding historic:civilization tag using “Ancestral Pueblo people”
> vs “Anazazi”, I think I’d go with “Ancestral Pueblo” as I think that
> is, from current thinking, historically accurate. I believe that
> “Anazazi” is Navajo for something like “ancient enemy” but could be
I'm going to ask in person what's the correct name as the locals think
of it. "Pueblo People" is a catchall for multiple peoples that have
lived there over the centuries and probably the least accidentally
insulting. There's always the old joke about some person who gets a
"ceremonial" native name, and later finds out it means something like
'stupid dog s$%t'...
> Regarding mapping of the individual buildings, my single feeble
> attempt at one site was foiled by the fact that it was, as is
> typical, in an overhang under a cliff with limited access. So my GPS
> had very inaccurate data and the site is not visible on aerial
> imagery. Best of luck in your mapping.
Yeah, I'm a climber, and it's quite amazing to see how difficult some
of the climbing to the cliff dwellings is. Some people think it was for
defense, I think it was to keep the rats and other animals out of the
stored food. It's a hard, dry country to live in...
- rob -
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