[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - Rideshare Access

Simon Poole simon at poole.ch
Tue Nov 3 12:01:20 UTC 2020

We don't seem to have a tagging currently for dedicated pickup locations 
in this kind of context, bus stops etc are naturally taggable), if 
considered really useful I don't see why we couldn't introduce a 
amenity=...pickup... tag.

Am 31.10.2020 um 23:50 schrieb Brian M. Sperlongano:
> The use of the proposed access tagging on roads to indicate whether or 
> not a private hire/rideshare can drive on them I think we can all 
> agree is straightforward, but it gets muddy when talking about other 
> types of infrastructure that this might apply to.
> I would like to better understand how such access tagging would work 
> in practice for an example at my local airport.  In that instance, the 
> designated Uber pickup/dropoff location is a particular spot within a 
> specific parking garage (tagged with amenity=parking + building=yes).  
> Do I add private_hire=designated to the building?  Okay, that can 
> work.  But then, adding operator=Uber doesn't work -- after all, Uber 
> isn't operating the parking garage, they just have permission to make 
> pickups at a particular signed location. This tells me that a POI 
> that's separate from the parking garage object is needed to indicate 
> the precise pickup location within the garage.  Are we saying that's 
> amenity=taxi + private_hire=designated?  That doesn't work because a 
> taxi stand implies on-demand transportation.  I would just ask that we 
> consider the full picture of how designated private hire/rideshare 
> tagging should be done at airports and other transportation hubs; 
> without that "big picture", merely focusing very narrowly on the 
> access attribute feels incomplete.
> On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 4:03 PM Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch 
> <mailto:simon at poole.ch>> wrote:
>     I think there is a bit of a misunderstanding here.
>     This is not about taxi stands or anything similar, but about
>     access for Lyfts, Ubers, Grabs employees to streets and
>     infrastructure that they would not be able to utilize if they were
>     driving for themselves (including actual ride sharing :-)).
>     Example pick up and drop off access at airports and similar, this
>     might include access to taxi dedicated infrastructure too. This is
>     quite legit and no beef with the companies wanting to be able to
>     model this to improve routing for their drivers and customers.
>     Simon
>     Am 31.10.2020 um 15:23 schrieb Brian M. Sperlongano:
>>     In the United States at least, there is a very real difference in
>>     meaning between "rideshare" and "taxi" services when it comes
>>     *specifically* to access at airports.  And I believe that is the
>>     intent of this proposal: how do I tag the special area in the
>>     airport where I must go in order to be picked up by XYZ rideshare
>>     company?
>>     At an airport, if you wish to take a taxi, you walk up to a taxi
>>     stand (amenity=taxi), where the taxi cabs line up, and you take
>>     the first taxi cab in line. This is an explicit area where only
>>     taxis queue up.
>>     Alternately, if you wish to take a "ride share", you are using an
>>     app to make an arrangement with a specific vehicle and driver to
>>     be picked up at a specific location.  In this case, airports
>>     often (at this point, probably "usually") have a specified
>>     location where such ride shares are allowed to pick up and/or
>>     drop off passengers.
>>     In some cases, the ride share pickup/drop-off locations have
>>     specific areas that are different for different ride share
>>     providers.  For example, at my local airport, due to
>>     disagreements about how much these companies should pay the
>>     airport for curb access (really), there is one location where you
>>     can pick up a Lyft, and a separate location 100 meters away off
>>     the airport property where you can pick up an Uber!
>>     The point here is that in the US there is a very real distinction
>>     between these two classes of objects, and the information someone
>>     traveling through the airport looking for ground transportation
>>     would want to know is:
>>     1. Is it a ride share (pre-arranged pickup) or taxi stand
>>     (on-demand pickup)
>>     2. Is it limited to only specific ride share companies?
>>     3. Is it pickup only, dropoff only, or both?
>>     On Sat, Oct 31, 2020 at 6:36 AM Simon Poole <simon at poole.ch
>>     <mailto:simon at poole.ch>> wrote:
>>         For starters I would oppose using the term "rideshare" for
>>         what is a taxi/chauffeur service. It should be noted that
>>         there are actual rideshare organisations and services out
>>         there, but uber, grab, lyft etc. are not among them, they are
>>         simply trying to co-opt a term with positive associations for
>>         their operations.
>>         Further, real rideshare services don't get special access
>>         treatment anywhere I know of, outside of vehicle occupancy
>>         regulations, which isn't surprising as real ride sharing
>>         simply involves sharing costs and car on a trip that the
>>         driver was going to make anyway.
>>         If there are actual legal differences between taxi and
>>         chauffeur access somewhere, we could use chauffeur or
>>         chauffeur-driven as an access tag (better suggestions welcome).
>>         Simon
>     ..............
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