[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - landuse bush

[Peter Elderson]

Then I'll stick to duck tagging:
landcover=greenery

Second place:
natural=greenery

Where natural means: it's a naturally growing or flowing element, even
though it's planted and maintained by humans.

Fr gr Peter Elderson


Op do 4 feb. 2021 om 18:33 schreef Brian M. Sperlongano <
zelonewolf at gmail.com>:

> Yes, "greenery" would also be a fitting description for these areas, and
> it is also familiar terminology in the US.
>
> On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 12:27 PM Peter Elderson <pelderson at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I think that's asking for mistagging. I can't see innocent mappers
>> tagging seasonal flowerbeds, grass, and mixed grass, low trees and bushes
>> as shrubbery.
>>
>> In Nederland, this is called "groen", i.e. "green stuff". The most common
>> urban variant is "gemeentegroen", i.e. municipal green stuff, because it's
>> often maintained by a municipal service. In a previous iteration of this
>> discussion I was told that "greenery" was a correct term for this, leaving
>> out who owns or maintains the stuff. It's just what you see.
>>
>> Vr gr Peter Elderson
>>
>>
>> Op do 4 feb. 2021 om 18:10 schreef Brian M. Sperlongano <
>> zelonewolf at gmail.com>:
>>
>>> The potential pitfall with shrub/shrubbery is that these (sorry)
>>> landscaped areas very frequently have combinations of shrubs/bushes, leafy
>>> ground cover plants, ornamental trees, ornamental grasses, and flowers.
>>> So, if we are okay with handwaving all of these different categories away
>>> and saying that shrub/shrubbery (or whatever the tag gets called) also
>>> covers these areas of mixed landscaping that aren't exclusively a flowerbed
>>> but also aren't strictly just shrubbery, then I can live with that as long
>>> as this usage is carefully described to have that broad definition.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 11:48 AM Joseph Eisenberg <
>>> joseph.eisenberg at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> This use of “landscaping” is mostly US English and may not be
>>>> understood in most of the world, where British English is standard.
>>>>
>>>> It also lacks precision. Is a decorative garden “landscaping?” How
>>>> about a vegetable garden? Just and area of grass?
>>>>
>>>> We currently have tags for leisure=garden and landuse=grass and
>>>> landuse=flowerbed, so I recommend focusing on what is missing: a tag for an
>>>> area of cultivated decorative shrubs (aka bushes), which is not a hedge.
>>>>
>>>> The term “shrubs” as the tag value will be the clearest option for
>>>> International users, since “bush” has very different meanings in Australia,
>>>> Africa etc.
>>>>
>>>> — Joseph Eisenberg
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2021 at 8:37 AM Brian M. Sperlongano <
>>>> zelonewolf at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> This might be a language difference, but in US English "landscaping"
>>>>> is also used as a noun to describe an area of human-created plants or other
>>>>> natural objects that are groomed for aesthetic or decorative purposes.  It
>>>>> includes lawns, cultivated beds of bushes and shrubs,  etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Feb 4, 2021, 11:30 AM Peter Elderson <pelderson at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I think landscaping is an activity, a craft or an art maybe. Not a
>>>>>> kind of object or covering. I think it is better to map what you see and
>>>>>> can be clearly verified by anyone looking at it, not what you know or
>>>>>> suspect has happened to make it look like that.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Peter Elderson
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Op do 4 feb. 2021 om 13:42 schreef Vincent van Duijnhoven via Tagging
>>>>>> <tagging at openstreetmap.org>:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From all discussion, I get the feeling that both a new landuse or
>>>>>>> natural value are not going to succeed because it is controversial to add a
>>>>>>> new value. Some will, I think correct, oppose because it would fragment the
>>>>>>> vegetation tagging even further
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I had a discussion with ZeLonewolf on Discord. Would there be
>>>>>>> support for a tag like landscaping=*? Possible values could be shrubbery |
>>>>>>> grass | trees/forest | flowerbed etc. For example on the following image:
>>>>>>> https://i.imgur.com/w4gAW6D.png 1 would be tagged as natural=wood (
>>>>>>> leave the discussion about how to tag the forest for now), 2 as
>>>>>>> landscaping=grass, and 3 as natural=tree. If 2 would have been low
>>>>>>> shrubbery for decoration, landscaping=shrubbery would be sufficient.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> This tagging scheme would still honor for example natural=scrub from
>>>>>>> scrublands and natural=shrub from individual shrubs. Also, the landuse tag
>>>>>>> would be left untouched and still available to only tag real landuse (like
>>>>>>> residential and industrial).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Additionally, landscaping=* would allow to also properly tag the
>>>>>>> content of a leisure=garden and leisure=park in more detail.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Is this a workable solution?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Kind regards,
>>>>>>> Vincent
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Tagging mailing list
>>>>>>> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Tagging mailing list
>>>>>> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Tagging mailing list
>>>>> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Tagging mailing list
>>>> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Tagging mailing list
>>> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Tagging mailing list
>> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Tagging mailing list
> Tagging at openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/tagging/attachments/20210204/091acf00/attachment-0001.htm>