[Tagging] Feature Proposal - RFC - shop as post-partner

[Peter Neale]

I agree with @Paul.
(in the UK, at least) a Post Office embedded within another shop is separate enough to be mapped separately.
They very often (but not always) have different operating hours, which you cannot show, if you insist on one entity with attributes)
In many cases they have separate, specially trained staff and a separate, secure section inside the building.
Regards,Peter 

    On Thursday, 11 February 2021, 17:13:56 GMT, Paul Allen <pla16021 at gmail.com> wrote:  
 
 On Thu, 11 Feb 2021 at 16:23, Robin Burek <robin.burek at gmx.de> wrote:

  Am 11.02.2021 um 16:55 schrieb Paul Allen:
  
      
   - One feature, one OSM element -> This is one shop - so it has to get one Objekt! 
   These are two different features within one building.  This is not a single node with several features, which is what you are proposing.
 
     
   - https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wii/One_feature,_one_OSM_element
  
 There is absolutely nothing in that which prohibits two nodes in close proximity representing two different features.  Or nodes within a building representing sub-features, such as elevators.   
 
Do you map then every meat counter and cheese counter in a supermarket as several Objekts (as shop=butcher or shop=cheese)? I don't think so, that are all services of one shop=supermarket.


Indeed they are.  I'd expect most supermarkets to sell those things.  I don'texpect most supermarkets to have post office counters.
I don't expect most supermarkets to have an optician, yetsome do.
I don't expect most chain stores to have a dispensingpharmacist, and yet some do.
There is a concept known as "shop in shop."  A business,partitioned off in some way from the rest of the shop, sellingthings you wouldn't expect that type of shop to sell.  Ifthey were in two adjoining buildings you'd have nohesitation in mapping them separately.
A supermarket near me has two wall-mounted ATMs.  WhichI've mapped as nodes in the wall of the supermarket building,because that is a perfectly valid thing to do despite yourinsistence that the supermarket building is somehow asingle object and nothing else must be mapped within theconfines of that building.


 And so the postal services are services of the shop/amenity (in this case on behalf)

Not in the UK.  In the UK they are legally distinct entities.  Co-located,and often with shared staff, but legally distinct.


 
 
   I am tagging WHAT IS THERE IN REALITY.     
 
In reallity there is a post-counter in another shop/amenity not an post office. 


Which you would have no hesitation mapping separately if it were in anadjoining building.  How about in the same building but with solidpartitions from floor to ceiling?  And legally it IS a post office.  Inone town I know of it is the MAIN post office, not just a sub-postoffice.


 
 
  And yet there is.  In any shop I'm aware of in the UK that offers a post office  service the counter is physically separated by barriers from ordinary shop counters.  One counter handles postal services and nothing else. One or more counters handle non-postal services.
    
 
An wich employees operate the counters? 


In the stores which have a main post office then it is usuallyseparate staff.  In the sub-post offices it is a subset of theshop staff.

 When the staff of the shop -> service of the shop.
 When the staff of the post -> post_office 
 That have I already said, and that stand in the proposal. 


You think that makes a significant difference, I do not.  In theUK the tills and back-end computers are different. Stringentchecks are made to ensure there is no uncontrolled mixingof cash.  Staff who operate the post office side have to meetstringent requirements that the other staff do not.
 
  You, however, wish to use a single object to represent multiple things and it appears you want to do this because you don't like maintaining two sets of opening hours.    
 
No, two sets of all. And not only me, thats is a wish in Germany longer ago. Thats a problem, that exists more than 3 years now (last forum) and have discussed in German-Userspace often before this time. 


Just because a solution works in Germany that does not mean it works inthe wider world.


 In last time I have solved some errors, because there was displayed an "post_office" that stands where none exists. And why? The shop, who operatet this postal service was closed often more than two or three years ago. And an user deleted only the shop....


Sometimes people don't catch everything when deleting things.  Althoughit is not hard to miss if they check the results.  Delete the shop, there'sstill a post office symbol.  It's hard to miss, if you bother to check.

So now we have two reasons for doing it your way.  Firstly, you don't likehaving to enter the opening hours twice.  Secondly, somebody was carelesswhen deleting a shop.  I don't consider either of those reasons compelling.
-- 
Paul
_______________________________________________
Tagging mailing list
Tagging at openstreetmap.org
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
  
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/tagging/attachments/20210211/d873842f/attachment-0001.htm>