[Tagging] creameries

[Jerry Clough]

A few observations:

* Butter & cheese production units in the UK were known as creameries at 
least until 1990 (I know this because I shared a house with a product 
manager of a national dairy company). The creamery in Campbeltown is 
still there, mainly producing Scottish Cheddar IIRC.

* Many former creameries & dairies in the UK have simply been demolished 
and replaced with housing or other new buildings. I presum the same is 
not true in rural Ireland

* Many re-purposed industrial & commericial buildings clearly show their 
origins: oast houses, maltings, distilleries, barns, cotton mills, pubs, 
banks, former shops (including corner shops), schools, hospitals and 
workhouses.  I have no problem with tagging these as explicit building 
types and am pretty sure I've mapped a couple of old banks in Armagh 
City this way. I'm not sure i would recognise a creamery on these terms, 
but if the salient features enabling recognition were documented then I 
might do so.

* There may be a case for a more general tag combined with a subtag: old 
textile mills tend to be recognisable, but there are sub-specialities of 
cotton, jute, wool etc., and in Northern Ireland in particular linen 
mills (also often marked on GSGS 3906). Similarly railway, dockside & 
canal warehouses, which have often been reused, tend to from types.

* I'm not sure one can infer a building type from the presence of a 
creamery on the old maps, any such tagging must reflect visible features 
on the contemporary buildings.

* OHM, like OSM, depends on people adding things. Using it as a general 
dumping ground for things not mapped on OSM is not really it's purpose.

tl;dr. Unlike others I have no rooted objections to building=creamery, 
but I think photos of representative examples & pointers to what 
distinguishes them from other industrial/agricultural buildings are 
needed on the wiki.

Jerry

On 17/09/2021 19:25, Anne-Karoline Distel wrote:
>
> I hadn't checked out Ireland on OpenHistoricalMap before, it seems to 
> be empty apart from rivers. I usually come across creameries when I'm 
> working on adding buildings to OSM and check against the British War 
> Office map to see if there's anything of interest, house names, 
> ringforts etc. I'm not planning of changing my efficient and 
> industrious routine completely around and only map historical things. 
> That cannot be my priority, when we still have 3.5million buildings to 
> map.
>
> We have building=church where the church is not used as a place of 
> worship any longer, but as a residence, library or restaurant and 
> that's tagged and seems to be okay. Why not creameries?
>
> Milk is not made in a factory, it comes from a cow. It might be 
> bottled in a factory, though. Unless it is non-dairy milk, but that's 
> not what I'm talking about here. From an international, not native 
> English speaker perspective, I would understand and support the 
> preference for butter_factory, but chances are that everyone in 
> Ireland (and the UK) is gonna tag them as "creamery" anyway, because 
> that is what they are called there and what's in the old maps and 
> potentially the name of the café it has been converted into or what's 
> on the blue plaque outside it.
>
> Anne
>
> On 17/09/2021 11:02, Jez Nicholson wrote:
>> The previous usage of buildings is something for OpenHistoricalMap. 
>> Many buildings were previously something else: pubs, warehouses, post 
>> offices, etc. IMHO the proposed tagging does not belong in OSM.
>>
>> On Thu, 16 Sep 2021, 23:49 Graeme Fitzpatrick, <graemefitz1 at gmail.com 
>> <mailto:graemefitz1 at gmail.com>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>     On Fri, 17 Sept 2021 at 03:39, Anne-Karoline Distel
>>     <annekadistel at web.de <mailto:annekadistel at web.de>> wrote:
>>
>>         I'm thinking of creating a tag for historic creameries. I
>>         don't know anything about modern ones, they could possibly
>>         included, but the situation in Ireland in the past was that
>>         farmers brought their milk to the local ceamery, it was
>>         skimmed and the cream made into butter or cheese and the
>>         farmers took the rest back home to feed to pigs or something.
>>         I don't know all the technicalities, but those buildings were
>>         purpose built, often still recognizable by their
>>         architecture, mostly vacant now, but some are converted into
>>         cafés, warehouses or other commercial uses apparently.
>>
>>     In Australia, they were often called a "Butter Factory", & there
>>     are still a number of them still named & standing, but sadly, no
>>     longer operating.
>>
>>         I'd favour building=industrial + historic=creamery plus start
>>         and end_date whereever known, and of course the current use,
>>         if it isn't vacant and/ or derelict.
>>
>>     I think that would be the way to go, except that ours would be
>>     historic=butter_factory. Or would =milk_factory be a good
>>     catch-all term?
>>
>>     Thanks
>>
>>     Graeme
>>
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