[OSM-talk-be] Zones 30 in Belgium
Jo
winfixit at gmail.com
Wed Nov 28 08:32:46 UTC 2012
2012/11/28 A.Pirard.Papou <A.Pirard.Papou at gmail.com>
> Hi,
>
> I made a round up of 50++ OpenStreetBugs Zone30 POIs.
> Many around Micheroux down to Fléron were already tagged, excellent.
>
They were tagged with maxspeed=30. Whether this maxspeed came from zone30
(F4a) or simply from a round red sign with 30 inside it, cannot be
determined. Therefore I prefer to add source:maxspeed=zone30 to those ways
as well.
Additionally it's interesting to know whether a road is within city
limits/built-up area/bebouwde kom/*agglomération*
After posting about this on the tagging or general talk mailing lists, it
became apparent the difference was denoted with:
zone:traffic=BE:urban
and
zone:traffic=BE:rural.
You saw this message, as you reacted to it saying that it was such a great
find.
But not so up the valley Vesdre, up to Verviers and Near Beaufays.
>
> So that nobody examine the same "bugs" again, I added a comment "missing
> Zone 30" that a hovering mouse shows and I suggest you leave a similar
> trace too.
>
I'm not sure I understand this. Do you mean there are more zone30 than the
ones we know about in Openstreetbugs now?
>
> But I remembered how vaguely someone not aware of mapping requests changes.
> I thought there's a better idea to make them understand what information
> we need and how to transmit it. It's to write a Web page whose URL would
> be in the comment or anywhere (I hoped it would be clickable but it is not,
> but if you select it, nice Firefox will allow clicking).
>
> So, I started writing this "Help us" general page supposed to expl<http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FR:WikiProject_Belgium/Help_us>ain
> several things that the general Belgian can do to help our project<http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FR:WikiProject_Belgium/Help_us>.
> (In French because these POIs are for the people of Wallonia to read).
>
> What do you think?
> Should I continue this page?
> Would you help?
> Can we put its URL in the OSB comments?
>
I'm reluctant to change all these Openstreetbugs once more (except to
indicate they are solved). They are mostly there to get an overview of
where works needs to be done on the Openstreetmap data. I think it's
sufficient you refer to them from your web page. It's improbable enough
somebody is going to stumble on a bug by accident and not knowing what to
do with it.
>
> On 2012-11-26 11:32, Jo wrote :
>
> The category in OSMOSE is simply called Openstreetbugs.
>
> OK. It was filtered out :-(
>
tick the checkbox in front of it...
But those OSMOSE alerts are useless because they don't show the comments.
>
untick it once more.
the easiest way to work with OSB is to add the plugin to JOSM, so you can
go back and forth between layers within one application.
> I went to have a look at some of the bugs you solved and I think it's
> important to add why there is a speed limit of 30 or 50.
>
> As I write above, I did not tag any bug. I just marked those that were
> already tagged.
>
But they were not tagged with complete information. If we are going to
solve bugs, it seems better to me to do it properly right away.
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/193218277
http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/55822233
There's no rush.
>
> If the limit comes from a zoneXX or built-up area. There are other traffic
> rules that are affected by this as well.
>
> Where is the Belgian Web page where those who have added those tags should
> have read how the Belgian OSM community has decided to tag areas and speed
> limits in Belgium?
>
Somebody still needs to write it.
> In particular, what is the definition of the "built-up" area you speak of?
>
*2.12. :* Le terme *"agglomération"* désigne un espace qui comprend des
immeubles bâtis et dont les accès sont indiqués par les signaux F1 et les
sorties par les signaux F3.
> ...
>
> Also I think BE needs to be all caps. 'be' stands for the language
> Byelorussian to me (I probably spen. When I look at taginfo I notice that
> DE etc. is also all caps.
>
> Both ISO 3166 (country) and ISO 639 (language) specify case-insensitive
> codes.
> Lowercase is usually used. Context must always distinguish countries and
> languages.
> As well as Shakespeare's "2 be or not 2 BE" :-)
> Although you could, you do not type talk-BE nor taxonweb.BE (1).
> You may have noticed that most of the DNS names are written in lowercase.
> Unix uses lowercase and uppercase is a Windows' habit being laughed at ;-)
>
>
> country
> language
> Belgium
> be
> fr, nl, de
> Белоруссия
> by
> ru, be
>
> It's more of a convention I got used to while working on
Wiktionary/Wikipedia. When I look at taginfo I see DE and FI are used,
which makes sense to me. If you insist to use be:urban, I'll have to change
my style sheet to do regex matches. I'd prefer to keep things simple
though, so it works on older hardware as well.
> I created a mapcss file that works well together with the
> maxspeed.mapcss. It adds an extra white border to streets within built-up
> area and a black one outside. An extra brown border is added to streets
> that are part of a zone30/50/70.
>
> Glad to know you did. But what is it for? Do you maintain a speed limit
> map and where is it?
>
If you want a speed limit map, there is one here:
http://maxspeed.openstreetmap.nl/
I don't maintain that one.
In JOSM you can install style sheets. These are simple text files, which
can be on your local hard drive or they can be hosted on the JOSM wiki.
F12/ 3rd tab/ Map Paint Styles tab
Select Maxspeed and click on the triangle to install it locally
To add the style sheet I created, click on the +, give it a name, and point
it to a text file with the contents of that style.
meta
> {
> title: "Built-up area/Zone30";
> description: "Highlight built-up area/city_limits. Works well together
> with the maxspeed style";
> version: "1.5_2012-11-04";
> author: "Polyglot";
> link: "http://josm.openstreetmap.de/wiki/Styles/Built-up_area";
> min-josm-version: "5198";
> }
> meta[lang=nl]
> {
> title: "Bebouwde kom/Zone30";
> description: "Markeer duidelijk of een straat binnen of buiten de
> bebouwde kom ligt. Deze stijl vult de Maxspeed stijl aan";
> }
> meta[lang=fr]
> {
> title: "Agglomérations/Zone30";
> description: "Marquage du fait qu'une rue se trouve dans une
> agglomération ou zoneXX. Fonctionne bien comme complément du style
> Maxspeed";
> }
> way["zone:traffic"="BE:urban"]
>>
>> ::built-up_area
>> {z-index: -5;
>> casing-width: 7;
>> casing-color: #FFFFFF;
>> casing-opacity: 0.8;
>> }
>> way["zone:traffic"="BE:rural"]::built-up_area
>> {z-index: -5;
>> casing-width: 7;
>> casing-color: #000000;
>> casing-opacity: 0.8;
>> }
>> way["source:maxspeed"=zone30]::zoneXX
>> {z-index: -6;
>> casing-width: 10;
>> casing-color: brown;
>> casing-opacity: 0.8;
>> }
>> way["source:maxspeed"=zone50]::zoneXX
>> {z-index: -6;
>> casing-width: 10;
>> casing-color: brown;
>> casing-opacity: 0.8;
>> }
>> way["source:maxspeed"=zone70]::zoneXX
>> {z-index: -6;
>> casing-width: 10;
>> casing-color: brown;
>> casing-opacity: 0.8;
>> }
>> node[note]
>> {text: note;
>> text-color: red;
>> text-halo-radius: 3;
>> font-size: 16;
>> }
>
>
I didn't add that style to the JOSM wiki yet, so it can't be installed
automatically at the moment. First I'd like to find out whether this way of
tagging is the one we will be using from now on (In Belgium and on an
international level). I'd also like to get some feedback on the use of
colors and line widths. Let's say, it's still work in progress
The maxspeed style (http://josm.openstreetmap.de/wiki/Styles/Maxspeed) uses
10 as the width for the coloured line indicating the speed limit.
My style adds a white or black border (casing) to that of 1 pixel and
another brown border of 1 pixel for zone30/50/70. Possibly there are better
colour combinations?
Polyglot
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