[OSM-talk-be] Wallonia hiking route schema

Fri Jul 11 03:13:14 UTC 2014

On 2014-07-04 16:02, Marc Gemis wrote :
> On Fri, Jul 4, 2014 at 3:46 PM, André Pirard <A.Pirard.Papou at gmail.com
> <mailto:A.Pirard.Papou at gmail.com>> wrote:
>> On 2014-07-04 15:00, Marc Gemis wrote :
>>> about which multicolored icons are you rambling ?
>> Can't you really open the hiking map, look at the osmc icons and
>> compare with "le balisage normalisé"?
>>
>> André.
>>
>
> which hiking map ? http://www.wanderreitkarte.de/ ?
> http://hiking.waymarkedtrails.org/ ? another one ?
> e.g. waymarkedtrails  aka lonvia is using it's own color scheme. It
> ignores all colors / icons set on the relation. Do you really think
> all the walking networks in Flanders are marked with orange signs ?
>
>  As far as I know there is no . So when you rely on Dutch or German
> people the chances are small that they stick to the conventions of
>  "le balisage normalisé"
> (http://www.sentiers.be/comprendre-les-chemins-et-sentiers/la-signaletique-et-le-balisage/le-balisage-normalise/
> )

Rambling ??? Who is?
Please notice that the subject of this thread is Wallonia and that it
quite logically deals with Wallonia.
(and that orange signs are officially obsolete and deprecated since 1830
;-))

Display the best waymarkedtrails like this
<http://www.waymarkedtrails.org/en/?zoom=13&lat=50.53749&lon=5.56839>
and see OSMC symbols on the map and under *Routes* like this:

	ES01. Esneux - Promenade des artistes (Ham)
<javascript:showRouteInfo('2078486', loadRoutes)>
	ES01v - Ham variante <javascript:showRouteInfo('2748841', loadRoutes)>
	ES02. Esneux - Le Tige de Fontin <javascript:showRouteInfo('2669918',
loadRoutes)>
	ES03. Esneux - Autour d'Avionpuits <javascript:showRouteInfo('2669922',
loadRoutes)>
	ES04. Esneux - Chemin des Carrières
<javascript:showRouteInfo('2669988', loadRoutes)>
	ES05. Esneux - Boucle de l'Ourthe (Ham)
<javascript:showRouteInfo('2224046', loadRoutes)>
	ES06. Esneux - Circuit de la Roche-aux-Faucons
<javascript:showRouteInfo('2697797', loadRoutes)>
	ES07 - Esneux - Parc du Mary, Heid des Corbeaux et Tessenire
<javascript:showRouteInfo('2688681', loadRoutes)>
	ES08 - Esneux - Rond Bâti <javascript:showRouteInfo('2688682',
loadRoutes)>
	SPR05 Sprimont 5: Tultay <javascript:showRouteInfo('2409036', loadRoutes)>
	SPR06 Sprimont 6: Gomzé <javascript:showRouteInfo('2406836', loadRoutes)>
	SPR07 Sprimont 7: Dolembreux <javascript:showRouteInfo('2405001',
loadRoutes)>
...
	... <javascript:showRouteInfo('2406099', loadRoutes)>

Typical tags:
website 	: 	http://www.ourthe-ambleve.be/insitu/fiche.php?lang=fr&cle=8053
name 	: 	ES06. Esneux - Circuit de la Roche-aux-Faucons
roundtrip 	: 	yes
type 	: 	route
route 	: 	hiking
network 	: 	lwn
oneway 	: 	yes
operator 	: 	SI Esneux
ref 	: 	ES06
osmc:symbol 	: 	yellow:yellow:yellow_rectangle:6:black

Other locations outside Wallonia show *Routes* like this:

	(1563591) <javascript:showRouteInfo('1563591', loadRoutes)>
91-92
	(1563607) <javascript:showRouteInfo('1563607', loadRoutes)>
99-123
	(1563608) <javascript:showRouteInfo('1563608', loadRoutes)>
97-99
	(1570051) <javascript:showRouteInfo('1570051', loadRoutes)>
99-197
	... <javascript:showRouteInfo('1590413', loadRoutes)>

Typical tag:
note 	: 	90-165
network:name 	: 	Rivierenland
route 	: 	foot
type 	: 	route
network 	: 	rwn

osmc:symbol <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:osmc:symbol>=* is
not peculiar to any map renderer. The symbol icons are visible only on
those that implement it indeed. Contrary to what you say,
hiking.waymarkedtrails.org
<http://www.waymarkedtrails.org/en/?zoom=13&lat=50.55297&lon=5.92837> 
is one that does and it suffices to open their site and look at the
German, ... and the few Walloon hikes to see it.

What does that "Belgian making a hiking map" mean?  Who are those
sticking Dutch and Germans?
Let us speak a precise language please.  Walloon hikes are chosen a
symbol by their organizers (operator ...). The mapper uses the
corresponding osmc symbol tag. The renderer renders that tag.  I just
can't see what the Belgian, Dutch or German rambling has to do with that.

An issue is that since 2007-2012 only 4 plain color symbols are legal in
Wallonia but that

  * OSM symbols, and even hike websites, continue to use other symbols
  * the sites do not use the official ref but some ID of their own
  * and the probability to "officially" jump from RED 3 of municipality
    A to RED 3 of municipality B now becomes significant

> So please bark at the right tree. If you don't agree with a rendering,
> complain to the people that made the map. File a bug report, send an
> email, whatever. We, ordinary mappers, cannot influence the color if
> they ignore the tags.
Again, what is that barking about rendering problem, what is "people who
made the map", what bug report?
We, ordinary mappers, do define the symbol colors if we tag osmc.
We, ordinary mappers, should try to use the legal symbol if signing is
as important as you say.
We, ordinary mappers, should try to use the official ref but when I do
StijnRR removes it whimsically.
We, ordinary mappers, should try to convince renderers to display both
official ref and unofficial ID. For that point you're right about
sending an email and filing a bug report, but I really wonder why you
say it because it's one thing that I've done already.
Your rambling doesn't make any sense.

André.

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