[OSM-talk-be] city names - bug in OFM?

Tue Feb 24 13:12:00 UTC 2015

Basecamp is a simple albeit very powerful project managements software
from former 37Signals company written by the inventor of Ruby on Rails.

https://basecamp.com/

I notice this discussion is about searching (geocoding) locations.  I
would suggest to not judge(or correct/change for that matter) the data
of openstreet through the use of search functionality in 3rd party
applications.

OSMand is a mobile osm centric app.

You should use nominatim as a reference as this is really closer to the
data than any derivates.  In this sort of discussion you also need to
take into account the date of the data extract that is being used to
serve the search function.

before you start saying this: nominatim is indeed also 'just another
app' but the main difference is that it has exponentially more eyes on
it whenever something works and it is mature enough to entrust it our
geocoding needs. Knowing this, I can shave a corner off a
troubleshooting process whenever something doesn't encode as expected
and suspect the data to be the issue first, the software next if
analysing the raw data vs nominatim results do not work.

Whenever I look up the name spoken about I find this:

http://nominatim.openstreetmap.org/details.php?place_id=175680

(and a street names as such)

So, level the playing field and use nominatim as reference. And check
your dates of the data dumps in respectively Garmin/etrex.

Glenn

On 23-02-15 21:40, André Pirard wrote:
> On 2015-02-23 19:59, Alain Bourgeois wrote :
>>
>> What is Osmand ?
>>
> What is spoken of as a problem in the message you sent and I replied to.
>>
>> In Basecamp or using garmin gps (e-trex), Maillen can NOT be found,
>> even without street.
>>
>> You will find Assesse and you have to know that Maillen belongs to
>> Assesse.
>>
> What is Basecamp? ;-)
>>
>> “Strépy-Braquegnies is not a boundary but a Residential Area (a
>> landuse). You can't use one in an OSM search. »
>>
>>  
>>
>> Strépy-Braquegnies is a city that has its own postal code (7110) and
>> is totally different from La Louvière having another postal code (7100)
>>
> I was speaking of what's on the OSM map, of course, and why it does what
> it does.
> 
> The name is not Strépy-Braquegnies but Strépy-Bracquegnies.  It is not a
> city (like Liège and Namur) but a town or a village. Nominatim would
> call it a village, like Brussels.
> Anyway, we're not speaking of built up areas but of territories.
> Strépy-Bracquegnies is a part-municipality (ancienne commune) that is
> *part of* the municipality (commune) La Louvière together with
> Besonrieux, Boussoit, Haine-Saint-Paul, Haine-Saint-Pierre,
> Houdeng-Aimeries, Houdeng-Gœgnies, La Louvière, Maurage, Saint-Vaast and
> Trivières.
> 
> If you sent me a map (GPX or OSM or digital image) of the boundaries of
> these part-municipalities, I will map them to OSM and OSM based programs
> will start working the way you figure.
> 
> Regarding Basecamp, please tell your problem to its authors.  I'm
> interested to know when and how it'll be solved.
>>
>> What if there is another street with the same name exists in 7100 La
>> Louvière? Nothing prevents it.
>>
> Only if it's the same street, else a GPS doesn't know which one it must
> go to.
> Many streets were renamed in 1977 to keep a single name per municipality.
>>
>>  If you are walking or cycling, there is 8 Km between
>> Strépy-Braquegnies and La Louvière. That’s a lot. If your map can’t
>> figure out this, paper maps might be better!
>>
> And if it's a city and you walk 8 km, you stay in the city ;-)
> 
> André.
> 
> 
>> Bien à vous,
>>
>> Alain  Bourgeois
>>
>> +32 496 51 85 75
>>
>> http://www.kineuro.com <http://www.kineuro.com/>
>>
>>  
>>
>> *From:*André Pirard [mailto:A.Pirard.Papou at gmail.com]
>> *Sent:* lundi 23 février 2015 01:48
>> *To:* OpenStreetMap Belgium
>> *Subject:* Re: [OSM-talk-be] city names - bug in OFM?
>>
>>  
>>
>> On 2015-02-22 23:13, Alain Bourgeois wrote :
>>
>>     Maillen and Assesse  are not the only bug.
>>
>> With Osmand, I find Maillen e.g. Place du Bâti and OSM finds "Place du
>> Bâti Maillen" but that's *near* Maillen which is a village, that
>> result is in Assesse which is a city.  OSM also finds "Place du Bâti
>> Assesse", of course.
>> Osmand also finds Assesse if you tap "villages" (OSM calls it a city,
>> not even a town, ahem).
>>
>> Kortessem and Wellen are in Osmand all-right, but, again, you have to
>> tap on "villages" when the list gets short.
>>
>>     We found other ones (event bigger).
>>
>>      
>>
>>     e.g. try to find Rue Jean-Baptiste Monoyer in 7110
>>     Strépy-Braquegnies. You will not find it.
>>
>>      
>>
>>     To locate it you have to search on … Rue *JB* Monoyer, in *7100*
>>     *La Louvière*.
>>
>> In order to find "Rue Jean-Baptiste Monoyer" it should be called "Rue
>> Jean-Baptiste Monoyer" and not "Rue JB Monoyer".
>> I have corrected that bug.
>>
>> Strépy-Braquegnies is not a boundary but a Residential Area (a
>> landuse). You can't use one in an OSM search.
>> You could if it were a (non-administrative) boundary, and even not, 
>> found in a subarea and Nominatim supported that, but that's another
>> discussion.
>>
>> There is no need to include "Jean-Baptiste" in the query.
>> Your street is located (nested) in Pont Balasse, La Louvière,
>> Soignies, Hainaut, Wallonia, 7100;7110, Belgium
>> So, any of these queries returns your answer: "Monoyer Pont Balasse",
>> "Monoyer La Louvière", "Monoyer Soignies", "Monoyer Hainaut", "Monoyer
>> Wallonia", "Monoyer Belgium" or "Monoyer".
>>
>> I'm not sure what the post code is or can be used for unless you are a
>> letter.
>>
>> Except for JB, I don't find a bug, less "other ones", less "event bigger".
>>
>> André.
>>
>>
>>
>>     I thought it was due to postal code, but sometimes streets are
>>     associated to wrong postal code!
>>
>>      
>>
>>     Bien à vous,
>>
>>     Alain  Bourgeois
>>
>>     +32 496 51 85 75
>>
>>     http://www.kineuro.com <http://www.kineuro.com/>
>>
>>      