[OSM-talk-be] IBPT antennas

Sun Mar 8 19:20:34 UTC 2020

What is the point of adding longitude=* 	and latitude=* to the nodes?

How precise are the locations of the antennas in the BIPT dataset? Do we know what the quality of this data is before importing?

I agree that the data should be kept up to date through a script. If you don't keep it up to date, most likely nobody will ever verify or adjust it, as the antenna's are sometimes very difficult to see from the ground. 

Do you plan on posting your import proposal to the import mailing list, to get some more feedback?

Perhaps my questions sound a bit tough, but I appreciate the effort you put into this. 

On Sun, 8 Mar 2020 17:46:38 +0000, Karel Adams <fa348739 at skynet.be> wrote:

> Over de talenkwestie zeg ik maar niet teveel, enkel een "bravo" voor de 
> oproep tot objectiviteit.
> 
> Maar inhoudelijk heb ik wel zo mijn vragen: wij mappen toch "in 
> principe" enkel dingen die zichtbaar zijn in het landschap? Die antennes 
> van BIPT die hangen toch meestal op bestaande faciliteiten, hetzij een 
> mast die voor iets anders was opgezet, of een watertoren, een kerktoren, 
> of wat dan ook? Uiteraard mappen wij wel die masten en torens, maar om 
> de antennes als dusdanig te mappen? dat lijkt me strijdig met het 
> basisidee om enkel zichtbare landschapselementen te mappen.
> 
> No comments on the matter of languages, in this complicated and delicate 
> country; save for my compliment and support for the appeal for objectivity.
> 
> But regarding "the root of the matter" I do have my questions: didn't we 
> have a rule to map only those features visible in the scenery? The BIPT 
> antennae (sic!) are usually attached to existing structures, such as 
> church spires or GSM masts or so? Of course we map those highly visible 
> carrying structures, but to map the individual antennae seems to me like 
> overdoing things.
> 
> Karel
> 
> On 2020-03-08 16:55, Thibault Rommel wrote:
> > Hello there
> >
> > Small detail, I believe it makes more sense to use the abbreviation 
> > BIPT instead of IBPT, since it is "Belgian Institute for Postal 
> > services and Telecommunications" in English and both Dutch and German 
> > also have BIPT as the abbreviation.
> >
> > --
> > Thibault
> >
> > Op zo 8 mrt. 2020 om 14:16 schreef Vucodil via Talk-be 
> > <talk-be at openstreetmap.org <mailto:talk-be at openstreetmap.org>>:
> >
> >     Hello everyone,
> >
> >     Recently, we got the permission from ibpt.be <http://ibpt.be> to
> >     use their data in OpenStreetMap:
> >     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Catalogue/ibpt_belgium_antennas
> >     This includes all the antennas (more than 9000) managed by the
> >     three operators (Proximus, Mobistar and Telenet) with the info on
> >     who manages which antennas and their localisation.
> >
> >     I wish to import them in a semi-automatic import. But before that,
> >     I wish to have your feedback on the:
> >
> >     *General workflow*
> >
> >     For the workflow, you can find it at the end of the import wiki
> >     page. The main idea is that the antennas to close to existing
> >     antennas will be manually reviewed.
> >     What do you think about that? Is it safe enough?
> >
> >     *Tags to use*
> >
> >     As there is around 300 antennas currently in Belgium
> >     (https://overpass-turbo.eu/s/QPC) and considering that this import
> >     will bring more than 9000 antennas, I think the tags of the import
> >     should be carefully chosen.
> >     The tags for the objects related to telecoms are not well defined.
> >     Various sources of information are available (see at the end of
> >     this email).
> >     If we choose to only map the antenna itself by excluding the
> >     support (mast, tower, roof, ...), it seems to exist two tags:
> >
> >     - man_made=antenna
> >     (https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/man_made=antenna#overview)
> >     - telecoms=antenna
> >     (https://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/tags/?key=telecom&value=antenna)
> >
> >     the first one being much more used. That's the one that I suggest.
> >     You can see more details on the tagging here:
> >     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Catalogue/ibpt_belgium_antennas#Data_Preparation
> >
> >     With the data from IBPT, it make sense to only focus on the
> >     antenna itself and not on the support as we don't have any
> >     information on it.
> >     In cities, it will usually be on roofs or underground like in
> >     tunnels but in the countryside, it is often on communication towers.
> >
> >     Mapping only the antenna enable us to later map more complex
> >     things like in this proposal
> >     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Radio_antennas_mapping_proposal.png
> >     <https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:Radio_antennas_mapping_proposal.png>
> >     where I really like the separation between:
> >
> >     - antenna
> >     - support
> >     - station
> >
> >     Note that today, most antennas in Belgium are mapped via their
> >     support (mast or tower).
> >
> >
> >     What do you think about the tagging that I suggest? Does it make
> >     sense ?
> >
> >     Vucodil
> >
> >
> >     PS: I sent two mails in a week about import. It is a coincidence,
> >     I'm not doing only that!
> >
> >     Sources of information:
> >
> >     - https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dantenna
> >     - https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Telecoms
> >     -
> >     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Telecommunications_tower
> >     - https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dmast
> >     -
> >     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:man_made%3Dcommunications_tower
> >     -
> >     https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FR:Proposed_features/Key:antenna#Les_antennes_t.C3.A9l.C3.A9com
> >     -
> >     https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-be/2011-April/001970.html
> >     -
> >     https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-be/2011-April/001971.html
> >
> >
> >     _______________________________________________
> >     Talk-be mailing list
> >     Talk-be at openstreetmap.org <mailto:Talk-be at openstreetmap.org>
> >     https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
> >
> >
> >
> > -- 
> > Thibault Rommel
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Talk-be mailing list
> > Talk-be at openstreetmap.org
> > https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-be
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