[Talk-GB] NaPTAN Stops and Hail and Ride Buses

[sk53.osm]

I doubt if anyone checks the Naptan account: it's an import account largely
to separate personal mapping from imports. Furthermore I don't know how
active the user who co-ordinated the imports is these days: info is
available on the wiki.

I don't think either OSM or NaPTAN ever came up with a satisfactory way of
mapping hail-and-ride segments. If you search back in the archives we did
have a bit of a discussion. I remember Andy Allan fulminating against a
great rash of non-existent bus tops local to him in Putney, which turned
out to be a particularly crass set of NaPTAN points.

The existence of a time-table attached to a lamp-post suggest that this a
customary stop.

Ideally we ought to be able to mark hail-and-ride segments on the
route-relation of the bus route (it's a property of the route not of the
local geography), but can't quite see how to do it. It's something I
stopped worrying about when the local council decided that putting bus stop
signs up might get more people using the buses. It took quite a bit longer
before the buses only stopped at the stops for setting-down.

Jerry


On Sat, Aug 24, 2013 at 10:27 AM, OpenStreetmap HADW <osmhadw at gmail.com>wrote:

> NaPTAN stops can be placed in one of the following categories
> (initially the not-verified one):
>
> - not-verified (imported but not surveyed on the ground);
> - verified (NaPTAN data has been correlated with a physical stop on
> the ground and the location adjusted, if necessary);
> - physically not present, customary stop;
> - physically not present and no associated stop.
>
> Near me, there is a hail and ride segment of a bus route, i.e. you can
> request the bus to stop at any safe place and there are, for some
> level of formality, no formal stops.
>
> On that route segment, there is NaPTAN data for a number of stops,
> which although it doesn't have local references for the stops, it also
> doesn't have a "customary stop flag".  On the ground, most of these
> correspond to timetables attached to lamp posts.  These timetables are
> not named, but you can deduce the name from the accompanying partial
> listing of stops and journey times.  Some do not, and I think those
> actually represent the end of of the hail and ride section.  People
> wanting to get on the bus, do tend to congregate at the time tables,
> to some extent. but they also get on at other places..
>
> My problem, which I've tried asking of the NaPTAN user on the
> OpenStreetmap itself, with no reply, is for the two cases:
>
> - time table on lamp post;
> - no time table, but probable end of hail and ride,
>
> should they be considered as:
>
> NaPTAN verified;
> not physically present, customary stop; or
> not physically present, not a stop.
>
> I've got a .osm file, sitting on my disk,with corrected locations,
> waiting for an answer to these questions before I commit it.
>
> (Actually, iti is really two back to back sections, as there is a real
> stop in the middle.)
>
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