[Talk-GB] Edits in Wales

Miguel Sevilla-Callejo msevilla00 at gmail.com
Thu Aug 10 10:15:09 UTC 2017

Hi Lester,

Have you read the Wiki [1]? Have you see street sing pictures [2][3]?

I'm improving the DATA adding a neutral and appropriate "name" tag as well
as the "name:en" and "name:cy" tags.

I guess that the wiki says is the way to do it, right?

Here we are to argue if it is wrong of not but from my point of view it's
the right approach because it is the same as in other bilingual places
around the World: some places in Spain, Belgium, etc.



[1] https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Multilingual_names#Wales
[2] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/BVAjyV5Yt6hediIk7Lqv4w
[3] https://www.mapillary.com/map/im/j1ngoo9wTxbfXfnMdcEGVA

*Miguel Sevilla-Callejo*
Doctor en Geography / @msevilla00

On 10 August 2017 at 08:40, Lester Caine <lester at lsces.co.uk> wrote:

> On 09/08/17 23:40, Miguel Sevilla-Callejo wrote:
> > So I would like to translate here why I'm using a neutral approach for
> > the bilingual tagging in Wales: mainly because I'm following the wiki.
> This is still a bit of a woolly area, but name= should only contain the
> information that is actually DISPLAYED locally. So if the street sign
> has only welsh or only english that is what appears in 'name'. This may
> also result in different tags on the same object where signage has
> different spellings or ordering, but someone looking for 'Fford-y-Mor
> Terrace Road' will have a good chance of seeing that on a sign. If the
> signs only have 'Fford-y-Mor' then one knows not to look for 'Terrace
> Road' ... In countries where different alphabets are used reading the
> signs can be challenging ;)
> This is then supported by name:en and name:cy along with additional
> name:* translations where people feel the need to generate them.
> Rendering a 'translated' map is then a matter of selecting the available
> name elements in the right order with 'name' being the final fallback,
> but 'Terrace Road' may be preferable for some translations even when the
> displayed name is only 'Fford-y-Mor' ... It depends just what the DATA
> is actually being used for?
> Making the DATA easy to use is the key element here not any particular
> rendering approach, but this has been messed up somewhat with there not
> being a consistent way to handle the evolution of the data. Many parts
> of Wales have been 'improving' the prominence of Welsh so what was only
> displayed in English now has the official Welsh signage as well. Using
> 'old_name' may be a way to record some of the changes, but we do need a
> much better defined way of handling the large amount of historic name
> changes that are currently 'lost' in the change logs! OHM needs to be
> feed automatically with data that the general consensus deems not
> appropriate to retain in OSM and the evolution of things like names are
> simply part of that.
> --
> Lester Caine - G8HFL
> -----------------------------
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> L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk
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