[Talk-GB] Using statutory 'list of streets' for mapping

[Vaughn Meads]

I cycled this route this morning (the Northamptonshire piece anyway) and looked specifically at the signs. The old sign post at the junction in Clopton for the Thurning road still points to the B662 in both directions, as does the even older signpost at the Wigsthorpe road junction. But there is no mention of B662 at the major roundabout with the A605 which has relatively newer signs. This indicates to me that Northamptonshire have also declassified the road, but have not had the funding or inclination to replace all the old signs for the minor road junctions yet.

> On 4 Aug 2021, at 11:17, Mark Goodge <mark at good-stuff.co.uk> wrote:
> 
>> Personally I would stick with the OSM tradition of the on the ground
> rule. If the signs are in place, then it is still a B road.
> 
> As others have said, old signs can hang around for decades before being
> replaced, especially in rural areas. As such I would cross-reference with
> other signs on the ground, including the *absence* of signs you'd expect to
> be there, before drawing conclusions about road numbers. Furthermore there
> are examples of roads that are simply mis-signed and that have never been
> correct "on the ground" - we do love a counterexample.
> 
> Regards,
> *Paul*
> 
> On Wed, 4 Aug 2021 at 10:05, Mark Goodge <mark at good-stuff.co.uk> wrote:
> 
>> 
>> 
>> On 04/08/2021 08:08, Edward Bainton wrote:
>>> Hi all
>>> 
>>> On a note <https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/1312848> near me a
>>> contributor has queried whether a road has been downgraded from B662 to
>>> unclassified.
>>> 
>>> It passes through Cambs and North Northants.
>>> 
>>> Cambs's statutory list of streets strongly suggests it has indeed been
>>> downgraded.
>>> 
>>> Northants doesn't maintain a 'list', but instead puts theirs in a GIS
>>> combined with OS data. (marked copyright Crown & OS)
>>> 
>>> Can we legitimately use either of these sources to determine the status
>>> of the road? (both linked from the note) My hunch is first, yes; second,
>>> no; but thought best to check.
>> 
>> OS OpenRoads is OGL and can be used to derive data for inclusion in OSM.
>> That will show the road status and official number, if classified.
>> 
>>> Also what do we do if the signs and the statutory lists are at variance,
>>> as it seems they may be?
>> 
>> In this case, I'd be inclined to go with the official status, provided
>> it can be definitively verified from open data sources. Signs are,
>> unfortunately, sometimes wrong, and even more often are left unchanged
>> after a road has been renumbered or upgraded/downgraded. It would be
>> rather daft if OSM was the only map which continued to show a road as
>> having an obsolete status, when every other mapping agency shows the
>> current status, simply because some inefficient highways department has
>> accidentally left a sign in place that should have been removed.
>> 
>> Mark
>> 
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