[talk-latam] cómo establecer un contact —estable— con YMUP?

[Mario Frasca]

Dear Rory, you wrote on HOT task 9844:

> From my understanding they made efforts to engage you and ask for your 
> help. Further, I believe the YouthMappers chapter in Panama responded 
> to you and shared with you the OSM Wiki pages (per the OEG guidelines) 
> they had created for these tasks on another OSM channel
While we don't provide links, we're leaving space for misunderstanding, 
so instead of misunderstanding you, let me tell you I simply do not 
understand what you're talking about, would you mind providing some 
detail?  I'm not aware of (recent) efforts to get in contact and 
definitely of any effort at all for staying in contact.  I do not even 
know who's the new president of the chapter, let alone the members, or 
their plans.

the DWG blocked some of their accounts, and in the text of the message 
they received there was this part:

> The most important bit here is that every single member of your team 
> is recognizable as being in our team (e.g. by writing something on the 
> user profile page) and that the team leadership is reachable for us.
The page they created does not contain a list of their members, and none 
of the persons who's read the message has complied with this request.

as said, we don't know who's at the leadership.

so, no, I don't believe the YouthMappers chapter in Panama responded to 
either me nor the DWG.

best regards,

Mario Frasca

the complete text of the lock message follows (containing still open 
questions):

> Dear Youth Mappers at Panama University,
>
> recently, a number of complaints have been raised against your work in 
> OpenStreetMap. Here are some of them:
>
> https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=12196736 
> <https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=12196736>
> https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=4366434 
> <https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=4366434>
> https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=4366436 
> <https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=4366436>
> https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=4928257 
> <https://resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-discussion-comments?uid=4928257>
>
> We’re always happy if new poeple join OSM, but if you train students 
> to contribute to OSM, you have a responsibility to monitor the quality 
> and ensure that if other mappers raise complaints, these complaints 
> are heard and acted upon.
>
> In your future work in OSM, please observe the organised editing 
> guidelines outlined here:
>
> https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Organised_Editing_Guidelines 
> <https://wiki.osmfoundation.org/wiki/Organised_Editing_Guidelines>
>
> The most important bit here is that every single member of your team 
> is recognizable as being in our team (e.g. by writing something on the 
> user profile page) and that the team leadership is reachable for us.
>
> The guidelines also require that you document your mapping efforts. 
> One user has done this for you in his diary entry:
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/mariotomo/diary/395025 
> <https://www.openstreetmap.org/user/mariotomo/diary/395025>
>
> But this is not a job that the community should be doing for you - it 
> is you whou should be providing this documentation.
>
> Please, in your future OSM projects, ensure that students receive 
> proper training and follow the organised editing guidelines.
>
> It is not a big deal if someone makes a mistake - we all make 
> mistakes. But, since you are introducing new people to OSM every year, 
> you really need to make it a part of that introduction to explain to 
> students that they need to work together with the existing OSM 
> community, and that they don’t exist in an empty space.
>
> I am writing this as a block message to all accounts that are 
> currently involved hoping that it finally reaches someone who is 
> responsible, as the individual accounts do not list a contact address, 
> have not reacted to changeset comments, and emails from OSM mappers to 
> info at youthmappers.org <mailto:info at youthmappers.org> have been without 
> response.
>
> Please ignore this message and accept my apologies if you are not 
> involved with the group.
>
> Thank you for your understanding Frederik Ramm OSMF Data Workin Group 
> Ticket#2020120710000024


On 14/12/2020 08:48, Mario Frasca wrote:
> queridos jóvenes mapeadores de la universidad de Panamá,
>
> estoy comentando unas ediciones que están entrando en vuestras áreas 
> de interés, ejecutadas en forma de revisión de los datos brutos, sea 
> insertados durante vuestros "mapathon", sea llegando gracias a los 
> proyectos que siguen abiertos y siguen atrayendo principiantes.
>
> en particular Marianne_pty me responde 
> (https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/95350683), y me pide que no 
> le dé comentarios generales.
>
> pero, cuál canal tenemos abierto, para los comentarios generales?
>
> intento vuestro correo e involucro la lista regional.
>
> en el caso de Colón, los YMUP han escojido un lugar en que se está 
> tumbando y reconstruyendo. las fotos están —todas — desactualizadas, 
> Bing muestra una realidad que ya no existe, mientras Maxar muestra 
> muchos edificios destechados, o sea ya no son `building` sino 
> `disused:`, `abandoned:` o quizás serían `landuse=greenfield`, tal vez 
> ya `landuse=construction` o podrían ser nuevos edificios ya entregados.
>
> o sea: al momento mapear Colón es difícil, y les cuento que no 
> entiendo vuestra decisión de empujar maperos principiantes en un lugar 
> tan complicado y dinámico.  igualmente difícil (aunque menos dinámico) 
> es vuestro mapeo de San Miguelito, donde tuvieron que llamar expertos 
> extranjeros, creo que de HOT, para revisar las ediciones, que lo están 
> haciendo sin consultarse con los maperos activos en el país.
>
> Marianne_pty escribe que vuestro grupo también se siente comprometido 
> con "la zona de Chiriquí afectada por el Huracán". pero no entiendo, 
> ya tienen sin completar la actividad HOT 4917, el área de Guna Nega, 
> las comunidades amenazadas por los ríos en en sur del distrito de 
> Mariato, porqué no concentrarse en una cosa, sencilla o por lo menos a 
> su alcance, y completarla aprendiendo de ella?
>
> además: cuál zona? 
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:YMUP-2020-11-organized-editing-Chiriqu%C3%AD.jpg
>
> cordialmente,
>
> Mario Frasca
>
>
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