[Talk-se] Mapbox Organized Editing

Fri Mar 21 11:27:44 UTC 2025

Denna övertro på NVDB är varför jag i princip helt slutat med OSM. Det är
inte kul längre. Finns ingen poäng med att rita av en annan databas när man
bara kan använda den databasen istället.
/Andreas

On Fri, Mar 21, 2025 at 7:59 AM Erik Johansson <erjohan at gmail.com> wrote:

> Mapping with nvdb is mostly the best armchair mapping, but I agree with
> Zvenzzon. Would go so far as to say if you replace geometry with nvdb it is
> hard to be responsible.
>
> I use it for correcting ortoerrors.
>
> Troger is the DEM available as a tile source now?
>
>
> /emj
>
> Den tors 20 mars 2025 22:01Anders Torger via Talk-se <
> talk-se at openstreetmap.org> skrev:
>
>> While there quality in NVDB does vary (it's a collection of multiple
>> sources) and geometry simplifications does occur, it's on average very
>> good. You cannot get the same accuracy from Bing or ESRI imagery, if you
>> want to get similar precision from ortophoto you would need lantmäteriet's
>> own. Sure if you have your own diff-GPS system you can get more precise,
>> but most maps from some sort of orthophoto, usually with limited elevation
>> correction leading to fairly large positional errors.
>>
>> Ideally you should use NVDB + Orthophoto + strava heatmap for sanity
>> checking + local knowledge where available. I've mapped tens of thousands
>> of roads in this manner in northern Sweden and quality of NVDB is very
>> good, while roads mapped on (especially older) ortophoto in hilly regions
>> can be very far off the mark. In city geometry stuff get a bit more
>> complicated, because there may be simplifications made for navigation which
>> may not match with OSM tradition, and there you need to deviate at times.
>> We have an ongoing manual import project with documentation of limitations
>> and caveats. You should never import blindly, that's why the NVDB import
>> project (or rather manual merging) takes such long time. If you see errors
>> like duplicated geometries, clearly the mapper hasn't paid much attention
>> to his or her merging effort. Any source if misused leads to poor results.
>>
>> It's best to use multiple sources and if working in Sweden NVDB should
>> for sure be one of them, and if the only positional data you have is NVDB
>> and an ortophoto from Bing or Esri, NVDB is nearly always better
>> positioned, with the exception of geometry simplification possibly
>> occurring on multi-lane roads, or sometimes very new forestry roads with
>> preliminary geometry and other rare exceptions. Naming of forestry roads
>> can be wonky in places, as the reporting can be patchy and approximate
>> depending on forestry company responsible for the reporting. Naming of
>> roads in cities are usually of very high quality.
>>
>> The problem with OSM in Sweden is that the coverage can be patchy in
>> places where there are few active mappers, and some mapping can be rather
>> outdated. The big cities are usually well covered, or home cities of super
>> mappers. There are large areas in Sweden which is only occasionally paid
>> attention to, and there mapping work from people without access to the
>> ground is needed, and in such a situation using NVDB in a responsible way
>> as one of the key sources is the best way to go.
>>
>> However, if the mapper doesn't really want to make the effort to use NVDB
>> responsibly and not knowing about its limitations or how you relate to
>> existing mapping, it's best to not use it of course.
>>
>> /Anders
>>
>> On 2025-03-20 13:07, Peter Svensson wrote:
>>
>> I disagree. The only things that shows exact locations of Swedish roads
>> are the ground itself. Everything else is approximations and
>> simplifications which are by definition "not exact". I've lost count of how
>> many things I've cleaned up after various NVDB import efforts, such as
>> incorrect names and duplicated/questionable geometries.
>>
>> I encourage use of other sources than NVDB for mapping missing roads.
>>
>> With regards,
>>
>> zvenzzon
>>
>>
>>
>> Den tors 20 mars 2025 12:31Markku Siipola via Talk-se <
>> talk-se at openstreetmap.org> skrev:
>>
>> Your answers shows you are not aware of NDBD, the National road database.
>> This source should always be used, and not any source. The NVDB shows the
>> exact locations of Swedish roads. It's waste of time of not using this db.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Den 2025-03-20 kl. 08:38, skrev Valeria Yukovich via Talk-se:
>>
>> Hello, Snusmumriken! Thank you for the questions.
>> We will be using available sources which are appropriate for mapping on
>> OSM (satellite and street-level imagery, for example). Besides that, we
>> will be also using Mapbox telemetry data and GPS traces in cases when
>> there is limited evidence. More information about Mapbox telemetry data can
>> be found here: https://www.mapbox.com/telemetry.
>> Speaking about our experience with other countries, we mostly encountered
>> missing roads in newly built residential areas and around commercial
>> objects, which we did not map in cases if the evidence (street-level
>> imagery or up-to-date satellites, information from the telemetry) was not
>> enough for mapping.
>>
>> On Wed, Mar 19, 2025 at 12:18 PM Snusmumriken <
>> snusmumriken.mapper at runbox.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 2025-03-18 at 16:46 +0300, Valeria Yukovich via Talk-se wrote:
>> > Hello from the Mapbox team!
>> >
>> > Our team has been mapping missing roads since May (as described
>> > here: https://community.openstreetmap.org/t/mapbox-organized-editing-
>> > missing-roads/113678) and currently we are preparing to expand the
>> > effort to Sweden.
>>
>> Hi
>>
>> I have basically two questions:
>> - What sources will you be using in Sweden?
>> - What are the most common problems you've encountered in other
>> countries?
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Talk-se mailing listTalk-se at openstreetmap.orghttps://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-se
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Talk-se mailing list
>> Talk-se at openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-se
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Talk-se mailing list
>> Talk-se at openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-se
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Talk-se mailing list
>> Talk-se at openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-se
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Talk-se mailing list
> Talk-se at openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-se
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-se/attachments/20250321/2ddaebf2/attachment.htm>