[Talk-us] Ferries

Sat Nov 9 05:50:08 UTC 2013

Re the ferry waiting areas, I've been tagging each lane as an individual way
with the tags highway=service, the lane # in the name=* tag, and have made
it be one-way. I have also done this for each lane going into the
tollbooths. See the Mukilteo ferry terminal [1] and Edmonds ferry terminal
[2] for examples. I was not the first to do this; it was previously done at
some of BC Ferries' terminals, for example take a look at the Tsawwassen
terminal [3] and the Horseshoe Bay terminal. [4] What do you guys think of
this way of mapping ferry terminals. I know it's kinda going off on a
tangent, but I just thought it would be good to bring up.

Also, what is the proper way of mapping ferry routes when the ferries have
multiple berths/ docks at a terminal (and they use whatever one they feel
like), like in the Horseshoe Bay example, and many BC Ferries' major
terminals for that matter? Martijn, could you do a routing test on these
ferry routes and tell me how it works? The wiki says to connect ferry routes
directly to a road on land rather than another ferry route way in order to
ensure proper routing.

-Compdude

Links:

[1] http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=18/47.94864/-122.30474

[2] http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/47.81123/-122.38429
<http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=17/47.81123/-122.38429&layers=N> 

[3] http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/49.0074/-123.1309

[4] http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=16/49.3721/-123.2745

From: Clifford Snow [mailto:clifford at snowandsnow.us] 
Sent: Friday, November 8, 2013 7:19 PM
To: Paul Johnson
Cc: talk-us
Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Ferries

If we have consensus on what the US thinks is appropriate, then I agree that
it belongs on the tag list. 

Does anyone have objection to bringing a proposal to create a
highway=ferry_link tag? I'd especially like to hear from people working with
routing (that's you Telenav)

Is ferry_link the appropriate tag? The ferries I ride all have a queue area.
Do we tag the queues like parking lots with a way through the queue? 

On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at 6:19 PM, Paul Johnson <baloo at ursamundi.org> wrote:

Probably, but in this conversation's defense, Washington State has the
world's largest ferry fleet by far, so it's much more a Washingtonism than
anything.

On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at 7:17 PM, Evin Fairchild <evindfair at gmail.com> wrote:

Shouldn't we be discussing this on the tagging mailing list rather than the
talk-us mailing list? After all, ferries are all around the world, so we
should discuss this at the tagging mailing list rather than here if we want
to introduce a new highway=ferry_link tag.

-Compdude

From: Ivan Komarov [mailto:jkomarov at gmail.com] 
Sent: Friday, November 8, 2013 9:16 AM
To: Paul Johnson
Cc: talk-us
Subject: Re: [Talk-us] Ferries

I'd vote for introducing a new tag, that is highway=ferry_link, rather than
trying to use an existing one that does not describe the object correctly.
There used to be and there will be disputes on this topic unless we have it
fixed. Introducing a new tagging scheme will cause some issues for a while,
but on the long run it would work better, I believe. 

On 8 Nov 2013 07:04, "Paul Johnson" <baloo at ursamundi.org> wrote:

I think highway=unclassified works, particularly if it's the fire lane used
for exiting the ferry that's always kept free of the ferry queue; not sure
how I'd tag the queue lot.

On Fri, Nov 8, 2013 at 8:56 AM, Greg Troxel <gdt at ir.bbn.com> wrote:

Martijn van Exel <martijnv at telenav.com> writes:

> It's the other way around, really. We're adjusting our routing logic
> to adapt to OSM. Referring to the wiki, a service road is 'Generally
> for access to a building, motorway service station, beach, campsite,
> industrial estate, business park, etc.' - so by that definition, a
> service road would typically only occur at the beginning or the end of
> the route, and that's what we tell our routing engine to do. If it
> were to turn out that this definition of what a service road is, is in
> fact not how it is generally used in mapping, then we'd need to
> revisit the wiki (and our routing rules) - but from what I have seen
> in my pretty extensive mapping experience in the U.S., the definition
> generally holds. So it makes sense to me to suggest a different
> tagging for these ferry access routes, not only (and not even
> primarily) to satisfy our or any third party logic using the data, but
> to bring more consistency to OSM in general.

That's fair enough.  I got the wrong impression earlier (perhaps my
misreading) that this was about a particular routing engine rather than
the documented semantics.

So perhaps highway=ferry_link, or perhaps the roads should just be
highway=unclassified.

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-- 

Clifford

OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch

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