[OSM-talk] threats

[David Groom]

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "SteveC" <steve at asklater.com>
To: <talk at openstreetmap.org>
Sent: Sunday, July 23, 2006 11:06 AM
Subject: [OSM-talk] threats


>I can see this might start a flame war but I'd rather at least talk
> about it.
>
> Imi came on instant message today, he wants to set up an anonymous
> account so that anyone can upload 'anonymously' from JOSM to OSM. I
> pointed out the following problems.

Can someone (Imi ?) explain to me the real benefit of an anonymous account, 
other than the fact that a new user does not have to go through the very 
small step of setting up his own account?



>
> First, if anyone uses it to delete all the nodes or anything else stupid
> then I have to deactivate the entire account. I can't sit around pouring
> through the history. Currently you can't look through the history easily
> as an end user.
>
> Second, if anyone uses that account to upload copyrighted data and we
> get a cease and desist then I have to remove everything that account
> did.
>
> Third, it's just not due diligence to allow it.
>
> There are arguments for allowing ip address-based editing like wikipedia
> but it's not implemented at all.
>
> So we went on to IRC as jabber instant message was having problems
> (transcript below, please read, I've just removed his password). Imi
> published his user/pass for OSM (thus compromising everything above) and
> said if I deactivate the account then he's off for sure. I asked him to
> reconsider, see below.
>
>
>
> These kind of threats are _unfair_, and having them linger is unfair.
> Imi does amazing work but I, or we as it is now, can't just submit to
> every threat to leave. It's also a stress to have to deal with and write
> this email.
>
> The other thing is the claim that I am trying to stop anonymity. Given
> the flak/flames I took for not releasing everyones login details, their
> gps traces etc (the entire database)... I'm just perplexed.
>
>
>
> Imi, please reconsider and let me change your password now its out in
> the open.
>
>
> ---
>
> * Now talking on #osm
> <imi> morning steve.
> <SteveC> talk here?
> <imi> sorry. con problems
> <SteveC> yeah
> <imi> damnit.. amessage.de is unstable last days..
> <SteveC> so I don't see what the benefits are
> <imi> well, I will not talk about "why people want to remain anonym".
> Really. Thats below my level :-(
> <SteveC> but hold on
> <SteveC> you were the one asking for eveyones email addresses and stuff
> to be released!
> <imi> Yes, and if you remember, I added in the same email, that I don't
> care about my privacy as long as I can be anonym and can decide when I
> don't want to identify myself-.
> <SteveC> which is a contradiction
> <imi> phe.
> <imi> well, anyway. I think we should provide an anonymous account,
> where the user don't have to enter an email. Alternative, we could give
> the probability to use an openstreetmap.org-email, if that is
> technically easier.
> <imi> everything else leads to bogus accounts.
> <SteveC> so what?
> <SteveC> bogus accounts are more hassle to set up and much easier to
> track
> <imi> so you call this a security feature?
> <SteveC> its security, privacy and copyright due diligence
> <imi> I want to ALLOW anonymity, you want to fight it.
> <SteveC> bollocks do you, you were the one who wanted everyones
> addresses and all their edits... thats not wanting privacy
> <imi> to all: if you want to be anonym, just use
> "immanuel.scholz at gmx.de" with password "****", as already written in
> many subversion scripts.
> <imi> and if this leads to an account deactivation, I am off for sure.
> <imi> :-(
> <SteveC> you're mad
> <imi> I will use my account for the testing stuff.
> <imi> this is now an open account.
> <imi> since I did not contribute much stuff anyway, I see no problem
> here.
> <SteveC> if that account is used for anything malicious I'll have to
> deactivate it
> <imi> or you remove the malicious thing.
> <SteveC> so now you want me to sit around all day looking for malicious
> edits
> <imi> and since all history is preserved, that could be possible in
> (hopefully) all case.
> <imi> no, I want everyone to sit around and look for it. Like in
> wikipedia.
> <imi> Jimbo does not look around all the day.
> <SteveC> but none of that functionality is there yet
> <imi> *shrug*.. ok, time to implement history in JOSM.
> * eckhart (~eckhart at p549BA6A8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #osm
> * eckhart_ (~eckhart at p549BA6A8.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #osm
> * eckhart has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
> <SteveC> I'm sorry I have to write to the list about this, will you
> reconsider?
> * eckhart__ (~eckhart at p549BA5DA.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) has joined #osm
> <imi> what should I reconsider?
> <SteveC> your threat to leave, and the publication of your login details
> <imi> well, you either have to throw me out or I will create an open
> account for people who like to be anonym.
> <imi> sorry, but I will not discuss this.
> <imi> I never thought you are going to forbid anonymity. I am very picky
> about this.
>
> have fun,
>
> SteveC steve at asklater.com http://www.asklater.com/steve/
>
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